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Forum Index : Windmills : Vawt...going in a big way
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shawn Senior Member  Joined: 30/03/2010 Location: New ZealandPosts: 210 |
Never fear with water in the blades they have a built in spin cycle  |
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mac46 Guru  Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
Hi Shawn, Yes, I worry to much...Kinda like a father sending his daughter out on her first date. I liked your comment. I drilled a 1/2 inch hole into the bottom of the wings just to see if there was any water in them, but nothing drained out. Dry as a bone inside. Hard to imagine that for all the storms and driveing rain I've had here in the last few mounths, even haveing problems with the phone and IP lines getting wet. Everything is soaked, makes dragging out the welder a chore. On a unrelated side note: The desulphinator is still doing its thing with the old batteries, simply amazeing what it can do with a bunch of old batteries. I wonder what the old timers did before electricty, and desulphinators??? ....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| Janne Senior Member Joined: 20/06/2008 Location: FinlandPosts: 121 |
Mac46, It's always nice to see a big machine come together. Good work! About the alternator, electrically speaking, it won't matter which way it's spinning. Only thing, that might make a difference are the brushes, if they're ok mechanically with the reversed direction. The alternators I've had open would have not minded spinning backwards. So it might not be necessary to swap the direction. The tach output on the alternator is just a lead attached to one of the internal AC phases, so if you need it you can solder a wire inside to get the tach signal. When it comes to wind power, the usual comment is that auto alternators are trash with their bad efficiency, need for high gearing, and the field current requirements. But they do offer one significant advantage over synchronous generators. If you can replace the stock charging regulator with your own version, where you can control the field current externally, you've solved all the aches of load matching. With the field current control, you can pretty easily put together a controller with whatever load curve you want. If you live in a windy site, the good load matching will more than compensate for the poor alternator efficiency. If at first you don't succeed, try again. My projects |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Janne God point on the alternator rotation but the thing to watch is the cooling fan as some do not work well when reversed and could result in overheating. Another advantage with an external regulator is that they are quite happy to be used on 24 volts as well wit only a upgrade on the voltage of the diodes, while some will work same will burn out if over volt-aged. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
Janne, VK4AYQ, and Everyone, The (GM 10SI alternator), is argueably the most for the buck around here anyway. This paticular one has an internal regulator. I did go ahead and turn it around this morning, I was concerned about overheating. 
I also installed the clutch linkage and overcenter arm. 
You can also see that I have installed an idle pulley. I have'nt installed the air compressor yet, I intend to wait until I determine just how much power and speed this mill will produce. I was only able to work for part of today, the company came and I had to give a tour of the project, I never fret about visitors, and curious folk, always have time to show them around the project. Thank you both for the additional info and insight. Thanks for stopping by everyone. ....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
VAWT, Going in a big way... Just a quick update, I fabricated and installed the rest of the brackets for the right angle gear box, also spent the rest of the morning welding inside the belly of the mill. Its to bloody hot to stay in there all day. "I'm always complaining about the weather". ....Mac46 Thanks for checking in I'm just a farmer |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Mac What is the ratio to the alternator as the mill will be around 120 to 150 rpm and the alternator needs to be around 5000 rpm to get any usable output. Looks like there was a John Deere doner somewhere along the way. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
VK4AYQ, As of right now the ratio is set at 7.2 to 1, that is if the mill's turning 100rpm ,then the alternator will be turning 720 rpm. // 150 rpm at the mill then 1080 rpm at the alternator. I know what you'r thinking..."well thats no good," ... This is the ratio I've come up with only as a starting point. This should be just enough to achive cut in for the alternator, and generate perhaps 10 to 15 amps @ 13.5 volts. The main goal I'm trying to achive right now is to enable testing of the wing profile. I will need to establish the incidence angle of the wings for best start up torque vs speed under load. I have several pulleys on the bench I could use to switch out and increase the alternator rpm. Also I hope to set this up for my average winds of around 10 mph. There is'nt alot of power available in a 10 mph wind, as I'm sure you know. The donner machine is in fact a Deere, 1964 vintage. I also need to get off my duff and get the break fabricated, this is about all thats keeping the mill from running right now. Thanks for you'r comments and interest. ....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Mac Keep up the good work Bob Foolin Around |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
VK4AYQ, Thanks Bob, and thank you for all you'r help and advice along the way. I'm sure the interesting part of this project is still to come, hopefully not to far off. But then there's that "Murphy" rule to contend with. ....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
Gizmo, and Everyone, I brought home the last 2 deep cycle batteries today, makes a total of 6 now, enough to set up the electrical part of the project. Before I install the batteries I need to cut a 2 inch hole for the conduit to go through in the sidewall of the mill base. I want all the cutting, grinding, welding, and other nasty spark produceing things finished before the batteries go in. Not that I need to mention this, but I have more strong storms comeing into my area. Glen, I'm still thinking about that "Frog in the blender thing", can't get it out of my mind. I can't say with any certainty just what will happen when I start this thing up...hopefully I won't be blending frogs with it, or anything else. Thanks for veiwing everyone. Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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TEA20 Newbie  Joined: 10/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 7 |
Great read  looking forward to the end result  Muchea W.A. |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
TEA20, and Everyone, Thank you for you'r interest in this project, I would like to welcome you to the Back Shed Forum. Thanks for the thumbs up. To my knowledge there has'nt been too many "vawt's" built and put into service that are of the larger size simular to this one. This is bringing some interesting problems to my attention. Strange machines these vawts, the larger size may help to expand our understanding, or at least my understanding, of some of these problems, and bring futher refinements and applications. Strong thunder storms here today and yesterday, so not much progress to report, other than the mill has faired another round of high winds, no problem. I'm getting tired of picking up tree limbs out of the yard. Thanks for posting, stop in again. ....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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Greenbelt Guru Joined: 11/01/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 566 |
mac46 This Link Is a copy of your mill but they have exaggerated it's size
Do You think a 10 KW would put a dent in your power bill? I tried to find more info on this as it is not described very well but could not find any references. I did not try the designer/builder co. ------Cheers, Roe Time has proven that I am blind to the Obvious, some of the above may be True? |
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| Xmaswiz Regular Member  Joined: 14/04/2011 Location: United StatesPosts: 69 |
can any one tell from the picutes in the linked article if the traling edge is open or closed? From the views of the 2 pics of the VAWT is looks like it is open. that would be really interesting if they are, and not just an optical illusion.  Santa Maria, CA. Noel |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
Greenbelt, Xmaswiz, Everyone, Honest, thats the first I've seen or herd of it or anything like it...I started construction originally a few years ago on the base and footings, but the primary design was in my mind at the time, and on scribble paper. I originally intended to build a "Lenz 2 design", but got involved with testing different wing profiles, thats about the time you,"The Back Shed people", were talking about the Goes222, after testing it for my self and finding it superior I went that direction with the wings. 42 feet tall, now thats a big one. It has me beat by nearly 2 fold in height. I can't tell forsure but the wing is'nt a GOES222, and appears to be open in the rear, closed in the front. I guess that I'm not the only "crazy one" after all, always a bridesmaid and never a bride. I'm trying to think of what "Homer" would say right now... Come to think of it, I e-mailed Glen a copy of my concept back then, not sure. Honest guys I am not a copycat, I don't do stuff like that. .....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| Xmaswiz Regular Member Joined: 14/04/2011 Location: United StatesPosts: 69 |
never crossed my mind about being a copy cat.  Santa Maria, CA. Noel |
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| TEA20 Newbie Joined: 10/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 7 |
Me neither... both look different, Im building one too and like you plans are in the head Muchea W.A. |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
Xmaswiz, Greenbelt, Everyone, I'm so sorry, I appoligize. I did'nt mean to imply that you were accuseing me of copying...thats just my mind raceing away, I have a bad habit of talking before thinking about what I'm saying. In this case typeing and posting before thinking. Pretty serious posting before thinking, I'd better watch it for now on, ...Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
TEA20, and Everyone, Hey, welcome back...good to here from you again. Again, "Everyone", I did'nt mean to ofend anyone by my remarks, please disreguard them, and accept my appoligies. ...Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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