 Notice. New forum software under development. It's going to miss a few functions and look a bit ugly for a while, but I'm working on it full time now as the old forum was too unstable. Couple days, all good. If you notice any issues, please contact me. |
Forum Index : Windmills : f n p gridtie windturbine
  Page 4 of 5   |
|||||
| Author | Message | ||||
gpalterpower Senior Member  Joined: 19/07/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 175 |
Thanks Phil, I checked out the Latronics ACTS. They are probably some what a more the Rolls Royce version of a change over setup. I'm not sure on the price tag either but probably would have looked into it before putting my setup together if I knew they were available. Mine is simple as you can see by the pic, and was born out of the Elect Engineering section where I work with the help of my electrician colleagues, but, rest assured..... it is MECHANICALLY AND ELECTRICALLY interlocked. I wouldn't have it any other way and has been checked by a qualified electrician after instillation! All components are new and are QUALITY Sprecher/Schuh and Finder. I wasn't going to muck around with second hand disused parts from what ever broken down machine! It has been working 100% flawlessly for the past year and the change over is practically instantaneous. It is fail safe in the event of power outages from line work or black outs where both contactors drop out. I thank you for your concern, and I do understand and can see the potential hazards of off grid hybrids, but I am more than happy with the outcome. I sleep well knowing it is a safe working system, albeit non compliant. If all goes to plan I intend to be off grid at the end of the year when the 60 cent rebate finishes so it will probably be redundant by then. Marcus if it aint broke dont fix it!! |
||||
| domwild Guru  Joined: 16/12/2005 Location: AustraliaPosts: 873 |
Tricky problem changing from grid to off-line and back. Requires a brake-before-make changeover switch system, either manual or automatic. Automatic ones to purchase requires deep pockets. They are three-position switches with an ON OFF ON setting, like the manual Hager SF263 63 Amp two pole model or a cheaper $39 lower-Amp model I just saw on Fleabay. From memory, there is also a Clipsal model available in Oz. You solved it via contactors, great. Taxation as a means of achieving prosperity is like a man standing inside a bucket trying to lift himself up. Winston Churchill |
||||
fillm Guru Joined: 10/02/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 730 |
Not sure what you call deep pockets for the Auto solution, the Latronics ATS are from $330 ~ $400 Retail, or if you search ATS Switch on the Ebay there are a few like this 30A ATS Switch $130. But the advise like this of doctoring ups, or applauding a practical approach over a "commercialised" compliant product doesn't make sense and really not the best advise to to be giving. A compliant product still does the job the same way yours does, it still has mechanical contactors but meets AS/NZ Stds and when installed correctly everyone's arses are covered so to say. Anyway enough said and hope it all goes to plan to get off the grid when the 60c dries up. PhillM ...Oz Wind Engineering..Wind Turbine Kits 500W - 5000W ~ F&P Dual Kits ~ GOE222Blades- Voltage Control Parts ------- Tower kits |
||||
Downwind Guru Joined: 09/09/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2333 |
I could not agree more than with Fillm comments, up to now i have sat back and refrained from comment, as this is a can of worms. Do you guys even know the laws of isolated inter connectors to the grid for the locations you live in. So far what has been posted dont meet the Australian standards and im sure it dont meet the NZ standard either. All good in expressing what you have done, but be wary it is far from regulation standards, so should you be telling others how to break the law, i would think not! Sometimes it just works |
||||
| domwild Guru Joined: 16/12/2005 Location: AustraliaPosts: 873 |
In defence of the person under scrutiny, it has been stated an electrician installed the equipment, so the installation is perfectly legal. However, I have not followed this discussion properly as several contributors are involved. Interesting automatic switch over equipment, like the 30A ATS. Thanks for that. That box switches or can switch on a generator on mains failure. In such system, isn't there a delay of 10 or more minutes without power as the oil has to warm up before you can draw current from the generator? I remember a story about the Dampier (WA) power station, where the operator switched the load in too early at the diesel generator and the conrods broke. A "power ship" had to be called in to supply power to the (iron ore) harbour. Taxation as a means of achieving prosperity is like a man standing inside a bucket trying to lift himself up. Winston Churchill |
||||
| gpalterpower Senior Member Joined: 19/07/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 175 |
Guys, guys, guys. Whoooooh! please. Thanks for all comments, fore and against. I didn't realise from what I have created and posted would cause such an upset and difference in opinion. I was simply stating on what set up I have. I realise its not compliant and knew that from the start but for me it is a working substitute for the ACTS. I didn't even know they existed and probably would have gone down that path if I knew they did. I am not in any way guiding, implementing or suggesting that others take on the system that I have, but mearly posting when was asked of what sort of system I have. Needless to say I have ruffled a few feathers and sorry I even posted the pics. Marcus if it aint broke dont fix it!! |
||||
| fillm Guru Joined: 10/02/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 730 |
Hey Guys, As I said back when I first commented, this has the potential to discourage rather than encourage . Marcus, you have not ruffled my feathers and say that with the best intentions. I more than anyone have upset many here over the years on things as silly as rivets. You are a person that gets is and has a go and it is good to see. I would love to post more on what I really do and what some of my customers are also doing but forum people get upset thinking that I am advertizing. Anyway back to where we are and Pete has summed it up pretty well. I think with everything that is happening here is well and good as long as it does not step over a line where regulations really need to be respected even if the item is "fit for purpose". This could go into a long and drawn out 5 pages of risk assessment with "what if's" abound, and it would be good to just drop it now. Dom,.... my transfer switches do it in 30 milliseconds and from battery to grid and back is seamless with hardly a blink. There is a generator setting that looks for a stabilized AC before switching . As far as engine management that is up to the start delay sequence, the engine management is a different beast , these guys Deep Sea used to make some good stuff. But I am sure there would be a mountain of them out there if you look for a Google solution. PhillM ...Oz Wind Engineering..Wind Turbine Kits 500W - 5000W ~ F&P Dual Kits ~ GOE222Blades- Voltage Control Parts ------- Tower kits |
||||
| gpalterpower Senior Member Joined: 19/07/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 175 |
Thanks Phil, and nicely said.I definitely dont want this to turn into a slinging match either, so lets agree to drop it now or it COULD turn into a can of worms with consequences. What I have is a one off and is working for me and me only and will be redundant at the end of the year. Marcus if it aint broke dont fix it!! |
||||
| DaveP68 Senior Member Joined: 25/11/2014 Location: New ZealandPosts: 292 |
Hi Fred Haven't been on here for a couple of months. Have you made any adjustments to this wind turbine now that you have the power output data tables as a reference? Cheers David There are realities if you do not accept, will lead to frustration because you will be spending time on wrong assumptions and the results cannot follow! The Dunning Kruger Effect :) |
||||
| flc1 Senior Member Joined: 20/11/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 242 |
Gday Dave, yea I have a plan to make some changes when its time to overhaul the running gear on turbine, I think I can get away with having both 36pole stators on the geared up shaft ,with a gearing of approx 1.6 or 1.7 to suit the inverters that Im useing,with no stator on the direct drive shaft, both stators will be electricly cut into 3\3 and one stator wired as star and the other as delta.I reckon I should get around 1.5 kw maybe even closer to 2kw, I will have to buy a larger inverter though, probably a 2 kw model, to be safe. With it having 8 blades it has reasonble low wind performance,but the 8 blades give high drag at high rpm,so its almost like a rpm governer,it went through one storm with no load on the turbine at all one night, I was unaware that the inverter had been fried, so it was peak rpm all night ha! No damage the next day,suprisingly. Blade hub came loose recently,put a new nylock nut on and a couple of small welds,just to make sure.Il have to change the mounting design of the shafts ,to take 2 stators on one shaft, but then I can make a better housing for the stators, because the present one is a bit of a pain to open n close. |
||||
| flc1 Senior Member Joined: 20/11/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 242 |
aerofoil shape of blades on my turbine  |
||||
Gizmo Admin Group  Joined: 05/06/2004 Location: AustraliaPosts: 5078 |
Guys a warning. I deleted a post a couple of days ago because 2 of the members got out of hand with their language towards each other. In hindsight, I should have just deleted the two forum members. In future this is what I will do. Be nice to each other. I dont care if your a new member or have been here for years, if I feel you are not been civil to other forum members, I will delete your membership. Too many posts are lost because a few members dont know how to communicate in a courteous manner. Glenn The best time to plant a tree was twenty years ago, the second best time is right now. JAQ |
||||
| flc1 Senior Member Joined: 20/11/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 242 |
To get the best performance from your fnp turbine you can find online at Alibaba.com a range of mppt gridtied inverters and mppt off grid inverters and chargers that are nz/au certified. With ac or dc input, with one of these inverters you could expect to get between about 1.3 to 2kw from a setup the same as mine.Setup details are here on page one of this thread. |
||||
| flc1 Senior Member Joined: 20/11/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 242 |
photo showing one way dampner fitted along top of the tail ,to stop tail hitting back too hard on seat during storms, my first turbine did not have dampner and nearly snapped off top of pole during a storm.  |
||||
| DaveP68 Senior Member Joined: 25/11/2014 Location: New ZealandPosts: 292 |
Hey Fred Just a thought, as to a simple modification to your wind turbine. How about you try and add a "capacitor voltage multiplier" and place it in parallel with the main rectifiers? I think it could give more power output over it's operating RPM range that I've seen you've plotted in that Graph. Cheers David There are realities if you do not accept, will lead to frustration because you will be spending time on wrong assumptions and the results cannot follow! The Dunning Kruger Effect :) |
||||
| flc1 Senior Member Joined: 20/11/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 242 |
Gday Dave Yep, good idea, Il have to get a larger inverter to match that modification though, The one Im useing now is only just large enough for the current setup . |
||||
| DaveP68 Senior Member Joined: 25/11/2014 Location: New ZealandPosts: 292 |
Hey Fred Sounds like it could run on the dump load too much in high winds considering your current setup described in this same post. Waste of good energy... Oh well another rebuild must be coming, so look forward to the increased power output results. Yours is turning out to be a very good Dual F&P, "all thanks" to those awesome Black rotor caps on 36 pole copper stators aye? Cheers David There are realities if you do not accept, will lead to frustration because you will be spending time on wrong assumptions and the results cannot follow! The Dunning Kruger Effect :) |
||||
| flc1 Senior Member Joined: 20/11/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 242 |
Dave when I pull it down in a few months time to grease bearings etc Il put a multiplier in n make another change aswell.Then we should have some warm cables.  |
||||
| flc1 Senior Member Joined: 20/11/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 242 |
vid of turbine getting a workout. https://youtu.be/A_3i2gQZlf0 |
||||
| DaveP68 Senior Member Joined: 25/11/2014 Location: New ZealandPosts: 292 |
Hey Fred That looks like an "Ultimate F&P Dual" Wind Turbine to me, considering it's only using 2.4 m set of blades and gearing. Imagine what would be possible using 3 m blade diameter with more stators direct drive? My guess is you could get close to 3 kW peak output power if setup correctly in wind like that... Cheers David There are realities if you do not accept, will lead to frustration because you will be spending time on wrong assumptions and the results cannot follow! The Dunning Kruger Effect :) |
||||
| Page 4 of 5 |
|||||
 Print this page |
