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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : [MM] 3 bit colo(u)r MaxiMite
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jman Guru  Joined: 12/06/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 711 |
@ Cliff The I2C still works but the video goes all garbled as soon you add the I2C pull up resistors 
John |
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| shoebuckle Senior Member  Joined: 21/01/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 189 |
Keep it simple. It has been said before that if you want all the bells and whistles, buy a netbook. I would prefer to see a ColourMite much as it is today but with optional satellite boards to add sound, extra ports etc. for those who need it, much in the Arduino mould. It will also help to keep the initial cost down. I can see the desire for more, but is this just for the vocal minority with specific interests like gaming and imbedded control? I would have thought that the beauty of this machine is its educational capability for teaching and experimenting with programming, monitoring and control, and for this you don't need 3D, a million ports and Dolby surround sound. I don't wish to sound like a wet blanket, but aren't we getting away from the original concept and beauty of the beast? For me, it is great even in its B&W guise. Cheers, Hugh |
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djuqa Guru Joined: 23/11/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 447 |
Hugh, I agree. Bring out all the MPU pins to connectors and a few ports, but let add-on boards and modules handle most of the connectivity. No board design will ever have all the ports/sensors/features that all users will be happy. That was the intent and success of the Arduino and the Basic Stamp platforms. The Olimex UEXT connector and/or a few SPI connectors would be useful, but even these could be an addon board. VK4MU MicroController Units |
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bigmik Guru Joined: 20/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2914 |
Yes it is pretty difficult to have one design do every thing.. Basicly the MM can be seen from two different perspectives. A Micro controller that can display to VGA/COMPOSITE/USB and drive real world devices or A Mini Computer that can play games, with support for joystick nun chucks etc. Whilst neither are more important than the other they both have different `desires' I will put my hand up as being in the first group, but the idea of color is very attractive to me.. I see a Microcontroller that is easy to program in basic driving a small LCD touchscreen in color (basic 8/16 ok by me) would make any product look pretty snappy.. Regards, Mick Mick's uMite Stuff can be found >>> HERE (Kindly hosted by Dontronics) <<< |
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Gizmo Admin Group  Joined: 05/06/2004 Location: AustraliaPosts: 5078 |
Yeah I agree with Mick, I'm in camp one. I use the Maximite to control stuff, as a versatile cheap little computer that I dont need to learn a new language to program. The addition of basic colour graphics will make the display easier to read, especially with graphing data, buts it's not a big deal for me. I use a couple of Maximites on those little "reversing camera" composite monitors, and as the colour option is VGA only at this stage, I would gain nothing. If there was a sub $50 vga monitor then I would use them instead of the composit displays, and then colour would be a nice feature for me. If I want to write a program that needs more than a few basic colours, faster graphics commands, etc, then I would fire up my laptop and use Just BASIC or similar. You can pick up a $50 laptop, install DOS and QBasic and you have a machine thats miles ahead of a Maximite when it comes to graphincs, sound, etc. It even comes with its own VGA screen and battery  What I'm trying to say is I think we need to be carefull we dont turn the Maximite into a PC
Glenn The best time to plant a tree was twenty years ago, the second best time is right now. JAQ |
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Nick Guru Joined: 09/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 512 |
I think you will find that most people who congregate on this forum would be in camp #1. The question is, what do those that don't, see it as? Personally, I think Camp #1 is the dominant but it doesn't mean holding the Maximite back from Camp #2. It is an area where it can become more dominant as an educational tool as well as entertainment. |
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| Gizmo Admin Group Joined: 05/06/2004 Location: AustraliaPosts: 5078 |
Yeah I agree. So long as we dont sacrifice the camp #1's needs, for the bling wanted by camp #2. If we're not carefull we could end up with a device that looses its appeal, and drowns in a sea of cheap netbooks and tables. My fear is we may loose too much functionality and speed for the sake of pretty graphics, etc. I've seen this before, I had a laptop I bought in 1998, with a parallel port, serial port, 2 USB ports, network port, ps2 keyboard and mouse ports. 8 years later I bought a laptop with 4 USB ports and a network port. I use the old laptop more often than the new one. Guess why? If the hardware interfaces remain, and the speed isn't affected to much, then camp #2 can thrive and drive future deveopment as far as I'm concerned. Glenn The best time to plant a tree was twenty years ago, the second best time is right now. JAQ |
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| Nick Guru Joined: 09/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 512 |
My impression is that we won't lose any of the existing functionality. I assume the colour Maximite only adds to the existing spec. Besides, if it's just for control work, the current Maximite (and clones) fill the bill already, which begs the question... what are we upgrading for? I'm seeing more and more of the competitor DIY computer/controllers offering colour graphics. Some with sprites and 24 bit colour. If the Maximite can keep it's low price point but offer some of these "Camp #2" desires, it can only help to sell more Maximites and establish the Maximite as the best DIY Computer/controller. For me, it's also that is an Australian computer and I like to support this... I'm such a patriot! 
I think, in the end, both camps are important and should be supported by members of each camp. |
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boss Senior Member Joined: 19/08/2011 Location: CanadaPosts: 268 |
Good afternoon, I have an idea. If the price of PIC32MX695 is under $10 why not to use an extra chip dedicated just for VGA? I would suggest to use 100pin version for MM and 64pin for VGA, sound and Ethernet. Regards boss |
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| boss Senior Member Joined: 19/08/2011 Location: CanadaPosts: 268 |
And the next idea. Why not switch from Microchip to ARM CORTEX M4. The price is same if not lower, it is an industry standard,it has 264kB of RAM, 1MB flash and it runs up to 204 MHz. Who need more? Regards boss The LPC4350/30/20/10 are ARM Cortex-M4 based microcontrollers for embedded applications which include an ARM Cortex-M0 coprocessor, up to 264 kB of SRAM, advanced configurable peripherals such as the State Configurable Timer (SCT) and the Serial General Purpose I/O (SGPIO) interface, two High-speed USB controllers, Ethernet, LCD, an external memory controller, and multiple digital and analog peripherals. The LPC4350/30/20/10 operate at CPU frequencies of up to 204 MHz. The ARM Cortex-M4 is a next generation 32-bit core that offers system enhancements such as low power consumption, enhanced debug features, and a high level of support block integration. The ARM Cortex-M4 CPU incorporates a 3-stage pipeline, uses a Harvard architecture with separate local instruction and data buses as well as a third bus for peripherals, and includes an internal prefetch unit that supports speculative branching. The ARM Cortex-M4 supports single-cycle digital signal processing and SIMD instructions. A hardware floating-point processor is integrated in the core. The ARM Cortex-M0 coprocessor is an energy-efficient and easy-to-use 32-bit core which is code- and tool-compatible with the Cortex-M4 core. The Cortex-M0 coprocessor, designed as a replacement for existing 8/16-bit microcontrollers, offers up to 204 MHz performance with a simple instruction set and reduced code size. |
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vasi Guru Joined: 23/03/2007 Location: RomaniaPosts: 1697 |
If the free development chain allow access to entire memory and do not limit the size code, then that is possible. I guess that a PIC32 will still be the option to go for a VGA display. ARM Cortex-M4 is better in any way. It matter also in what type of capsule came. Hobbit name: Togo Toadfoot of Frogmorton Elvish name: Mablung Miriel Beyound Arduino Lang |
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| boss Senior Member Joined: 19/08/2011 Location: CanadaPosts: 268 |
Hi Vasi, I have my own eperience while tested ELUA on CORTEX M4 ST32F4 (Discovery board 192k RAM 1 M flash). There is GCC (version 4.6 and later (maybe also 4.5)) support the Cortex-M4 and there is no code size limitation. The ST instructor remended us to use RENESEAS IDE include their C++. So there are at least two development tools. regards boss |
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| JohnS Guru Joined: 18/11/2011 Location: United KingdomPosts: 3801 |
Video is done via DMA on PIC32. Can it be done the same way with the ARM chips being suggested? If not, then how? A larger-memory, and faster, PIC32 is quite likely to be made of course... John |
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| vasi Guru Joined: 23/03/2007 Location: RomaniaPosts: 1697 |
And in the same spirit (as Pickit3) - 1000 cycles, as any proud consumable must have :). Long live to the best Managerial Staff ever! Hobbit name: Togo Toadfoot of Frogmorton Elvish name: Mablung Miriel Beyound Arduino Lang |
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| Nick Guru Joined: 09/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 512 |
Are the SPI channels on the Pic32 digital or analogue? If they are only digital, then we can only produce 8 colours using 3 SPI outputs. If Analogue, then high colour output should be possible. Are there 4 SPI channels available on the 100 pin version? If so, could the 4th SPI be used to provide an intensity control to the other 3 RGB SPI pins? Example: If Intesity SPI=1, half the voltages coming out of the RGB SPI's therefor creating 8 shades of the primary colours or 16 "colours" in total. Nick |
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| boss Senior Member Joined: 19/08/2011 Location: CanadaPosts: 268 |
Hi JohnS,Vasi,and Nick, Yes, it has see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HENNPZHFrg0&feature=related TV image generated by the STM32-F4 Discovery Kit. Frame Buffering 2 x 28KB Resolution of 200 x 140 px, B / W 16 levels of gray. Maximum CPU usage ~3% (DMA & 2 Timers) 192kB RAM, 1MB flash, 168MHz, FP ST32F4 264kB RAM, 1MB flash, 204MHz, FP NXP LPC4350 I think it has all what you asking for, plese check: http://www.arm.com/products/processors/cortex-m/cortex-m4-pr ocessor.php Regards boss |
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| boss Senior Member Joined: 19/08/2011 Location: CanadaPosts: 268 |
Hi Nick, the STM32F4 2012-05-29_204632_ST32F4xx_reference.zip documentation is enclosed. Ye have to search and ye shall find. Regards boss |
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| bigmik Guru Joined: 20/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2914 |
Hi Nick, The VGA connector does NOT have an intensity Input so any intensity effect would have to be done with hardware... it would of course require twice the memory to store 16 colours.. I assume we are still using the internal RAM for color video Map? Regards, Mick PS. If 8 colours is all we get I would be very happy. Mik Mick's uMite Stuff can be found >>> HERE (Kindly hosted by Dontronics) <<< |
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| boss Senior Member Joined: 19/08/2011 Location: CanadaPosts: 268 |
Hi bigmick, you are absolutely right. The question is why not to dedicate (cheap) CPU chip (doesn't matter if PIC32 or ST32 or MXP ARM) cover these needs VGA 800x600, Ethernet and PWM sound. Regards boss |
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| Nick Guru Joined: 09/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 512 |
Bigmik: I probably didn't explain my 16 colour idea properly... The VGA connector still has the same pins, no extra for intensity. VGA monitors don't use the intensity bit, only the old EGA did. My idea was that to take up 4 bits of data per byte to map 1 pixel to the screen. (2 pixels per byte) 3 bits for the digital stage of R G B (on/off) and the last bit is provided to the circuitry that feeds the RGB signal to the VGA connector which basicly halves the voltage level of all the RGB pins. Still only RGB going to the connector but instead of (example) 1 volt for a video ON level, it goes to .5 volt instead. This intensity works individually for each pixel which allows 2 sets of 8 colours, 1 at full brightness while the other at half... Ta Daa! 16 "colours". Having said that, even just 8 colours would be enough, just that if the design can be pushed further with little extra overhead, why not. |
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