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Forum Index : Other Stuff : Battery Rescue?
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Wombat Regular Member  Joined: 27/05/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 72 |
Hi Mac46 Just a quick note... I leave my batterys on strips of timber as I am under the impression that concrete kills batterys. Watching with interest, Russ  |
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| VK4AYQ Guru  Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi mack Looks like a battery reco shop good work mate. Wombats comment on rhe wood under the battery i have found that helps them keep the electrolyte at the same temp throughout the battery and make them work better but have never proved it actually discharges them, but a cold battery wont have as much chemical reaction as a warm one and may appear flatter when used on a high load such as cranking. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
Wombat, VK4AYQ, and everyone, If you zoom in and look carefully///yes there is lumber under those batteries. Very hard to see but its there, anyway, I've always planked my batteries...like you I have'nt been able to prove they discharge into the concrete floor, and in the winter the floor will wick the warmth away forsure. My desulphinator has already paid for its self the first week of use, reclamed 6 12 volt, and 2 deep cycle 6 volt batteries so far, still working on the bulldozer batteries...they are giving me a challange. Also working on a second pair of deep cycle 6 volt, these were left abandoned for 3 years in the corner of the tractor shed, showing signs of recovery. "The desulphinator has been going nearly non stop ever since it arrived", should of had one of these years ago. VK4AYQ, thanks a million for all the help. I owe you big time. ....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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isaiah Guru Joined: 25/12/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 303 |
Bob, We have had a similar experience. This spring when it was colder we had good luck on several recoveries but now thats it warmer her not so good, it may be the temp. difference with the batteries setting on the cement. will try putting them on timber. We have the old Tungar battery charger back in operation again this helps with being able to put higher current through the battery. Try at your own risk I have had some luck with the batteries that have handles of picking them up a foot or so and dropping them on the cement several times!! This process seems to help loosen up whats on the bottom.I also have taken a heavy hammer and tapped around the lower parts of the battery to help break up the surfer also. off subject weather has been lousy here this spring, too cold and wet for the garden stuff. Michigan U.S.A. Isaiah URL=http://www.motherearthnews.com/Renewable-Energy/1973-11- 01/The-Plowboy-Interview.aspx>The Plowboy Interview[/URL> |
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| isaiah Guru Joined: 25/12/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 303 |
What we found is that you have to determined the north end of the timber so that you can put the north to the north and the positive of the battery to the north. This will keep the electrons flowing in the right direction and not over heating by running against the magnetic fields. You can determined this by using a compass or one of these new fangled GPS units. '  '
If you are causing to much magnetic friction the local serpents may want to apply a small tax on you for that. '  '
Isaiah URL=http://www.motherearthnews.com/Renewable-Energy/1973-11- 01/The-Plowboy-Interview.aspx>The Plowboy Interview[/URL> |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Isaiah You guys up there have a 45 degree magnet deflection to the east, so you would have to find the null point before hitting it with a hammer, better idea to save the hammer for the local pubic serpants. Ply wood may solve the polarity problem. Bob Foolin Around |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
Isaiah, VK4AYQ, and Everyone, A word of caution, Picking the batteries up and dropping them could very well cause acid to be splattered up out of the fill hole...like a geiser spout. (not a good situation). Might as well put the blame on "magnetic flux", as sometimes common sense and good reasoning does'nt apply to the results obtained with chargeing older batteries. The re-bar in the concrete may induce a magnetic field, but I could'nt imagine this to be a factor, atleast a noticeable one. In times of frustration...walk away, save the hammer,pet the dog and kick a tire. Off subject, its been cold and wet/stormy here as well...SE Iowa, USA. Thank you for visiting everyone, Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| isaiah Guru Joined: 25/12/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 303 |
I have used the dropping process on a lot of batteries with no ill effect but yes you need to be sure the caps are on tight.proceed with caution in this process. We have had several HI Decibel events with electrical situations and this is a mess to clan and neutralise's. be careful and wear safety glasses when fooling with batterys and gloves. The plywood wouldn't work down there as it would scramble the poles and fall off and the electrons lost forever. Isaiah URL=http://www.motherearthnews.com/Renewable-Energy/1973-11- 01/The-Plowboy-Interview.aspx>The Plowboy Interview[/URL> |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
Isaiah, VK4AYQ, and anyone interested, I have been sucessful in reclaimeing 2 pair of deep cycle 6 volt batteries and only one of my bulldozer starting batteries. I also reclaimed another old 12 volt battery. The other bulldozer starting battery has 2 cells that are draining the battery down with in 1 hour after takeing the charger off. I was just wondering if anyone had a technic or proceedure for fixing this sort of thing. Its been on the desulphinator for nearly 2 weeks now and has made progress, at least it dos'nt get hot when rechargeing...just warm, say a 100*F or so. This is the first time its been off for any lenght of time since I started this regiment 2 weeks ago. ....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| isaiah Guru Joined: 25/12/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 303 |
Mac46 ,Bob and others, We had a old marine deep cycle self destruct last week, a real hi decibel event indeed. But It pretty well raised most of the top off so on inspection I found one of the cell connectors was missing ,I found it and it only had a spot about 1/4 inch in diameter connecting it to the next cell . What we think happed this battery tested good with the hydrometer but would only hold 10 volts at best was this cell connector strap probably arched and ignited the gas and took the top off. The connector straps are nothing like they used to be and can be the problem when you cant get one to come back or hold a good charge. These connector straps cannot be seen unless you cut the top off this is not recommended even by me.If I can find what I did with that connector strap Ill try to get try to get a picture of it. We win some lose some at best but Its a good feeling when you save one ,makes it all worth while. Check your water in all your battery's most have a sticker over the caps you have to pull off then I take a long dry wall screw and screw it into the cap and pull them out. If you look at the top of the battery and the sticker you can see where the caps are some you can run your finger over and feel them. Stay Safe we may need this information to survive shortly. Isaiah URL=http://www.motherearthnews.com/Renewable-Energy/1973-11- 01/The-Plowboy-Interview.aspx>The Plowboy Interview[/URL> |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
isaiah, Being around a battery when it blows can't be a fun thing, It make me wonder if I should have these batteries inside of a protective encloseure during chargeing and maintance. At least some kind of a canvas or plastic/vinal partition. I think it'll be alittle while, the polititions have'nt finished screwing things up yet. When it happens...it'll be world wide. Thank you for the aditional info, I'll give the drywall screw a try at those factor sealed cells. ....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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Rastus Guru Joined: 29/10/2010 Location: AustraliaPosts: 301 |
Hi Mac46, With over 13,000 look ins I'd say there are a few silent observers watching this thread including me!Cheers Rastus see Rastus graduate advise generously |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
Rastis, I have put some of the referbished 12 volt batteries back into service and brought the replaced batteries in for a clean up and a few days on the desulphinator. I have to say,...for a battery that was in the stack for "trade in", to be back in service and preforming normally just tickles me pink. The booklet that came with the desulphinator says it can extend the life of a battery...they got that right and then some. ....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Isaiah I just saw your suggestion to drop and hammer a battery, while I think it is a bit severe I remember one of the battery guys I worked with had a electric motor under his charge bench, it had an eccentric weight on the shaft and vibrated the whole bench, his theory was it helped the battery electrolyte to de stratify and also shook the sediment to stop it shorting the bottom of the plates. I never tried it but he did it all the time and he was doing it for years so I bowed to his experience. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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Gizmo Admin Group  Joined: 05/06/2004 Location: AustraliaPosts: 5078 |
Good to hear the desulphinator worked Mac. I saved a old dead car battery once with a desulphinator and it ended up cranking over my ride on lawn mower for an extra 5 years! I also think Bobs point about vibration helped too, the old mower was a bumpy ride. Glenn The best time to plant a tree was twenty years ago, the second best time is right now. JAQ |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
VK4AYQ, Gizmo, Rastus, Everyone, All I can say is that out of 14 known "Bad" and defunked batteries, 11 of them have been retrieved to usefulness...still working on the other 3. VK4AYQ, What speed motor was it that "HE" used on the vibrator????? I'm wondering if the frequency played a significant role, and did he leave "all" the batteries on the bench, or just the ones being recharged/desulphinated??? Gizmo, Hello Glen, Thanks for stopping in. I don't want to say to much about the desulphinator, people will think I own stock in the company or something, all I know is that it works in most cases...in my experiance, with my batteries. Rastus, Happy to here from you, and to be honest, I had'nt paid a bit of attention to the number of veiwers...wow!! Must be a lot of dead batteries out there. Then again...I had 14 dead batteries myself, take that times 13,000 people, (Oh My.) Thanks for veiwing everyone. ...Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| VK4AYQ Guru Joined: 02/12/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2539 |
Hi Mac Spread the news about the desulphators to one and all, because we are for conservation and batteries are one of the most ignored items in our setup's. The makers give enough info to keep the battery alive for long enough to be deemed commercially viable but they also want them to die so you buy another one. Batteries tended to be a bit of a black art and nobody wants to play with them because they got acid and can explode if treated wrong, like most things in life including the wife can get you in strife, so value your life. The electric motor was an old washing machine motor 1500 rpm approx and it wasn't a powerful vibration but very noticeable. Just the batteries with suspect cells get that treatment, because it shakes unconverted crystals into the bottom before conversion on a sound battery. All the best Bob Foolin Around |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
VK4AYQ, Thanks for that info, I was just thinking that the desulphinator sends a 2,000 KHZ signal into the batteries, and that perhaps that might have been the frequency of his vibration table...although 1500 is fairly close to this. I believe that there may just be something to this. I may have to do some testing and experimenting with this proceedure. (Like I need more things to do). Thank you. ....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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| isaiah Guru Joined: 25/12/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 303 |
One might want to keep an eye open at the yard sales for one of those vibrating heating pads I have one that I use on my back that has two speeds of vibration. Im not going to use this one on batteries, but I do see them either at Good Will or yard sales I don't have a clue of what frequency they operate at but there is merit in having the right or near right frequency, When I see another on we will give it a try. It might help with the heating pad switch on also to warm the bottom of the battery a bit. If you cant leave your hand on it its too hot! Yes you don't want the experience of seeing a battery blow up!! Back before I got into reclaiming Batteries I had my crawler dozer in a small Quonset shelter and it sat there over winter and we were in the process of starting it up when the battery blew up in my face!!!! the good thing was I wear glasses and we had a garden hose handy. I still had to go to my eye doc and it took several weeks before my vision was back to normal. We like to do the most we can out side as things seem to rust up when you do it inside much. We do have some pictures and will try to get them up soon on those cell connectors and cap removal on the Maintenance free batteries. When I use a hammer on them I use a heavy hammer and tap it enough to move the sides a little not using force to break anything. we have welded up cracks in some batteries but that will be a later post if anyone is interested? Keep some baking soda and clean water near by when fooling with batteries because you never know when Bobs old friend Murphy is going to pay you a visit. Isaiah URL=http://www.motherearthnews.com/Renewable-Energy/1973-11- 01/The-Plowboy-Interview.aspx>The Plowboy Interview[/URL> |
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| mac46 Guru Joined: 07/02/2008 Location: United StatesPosts: 412 |
isaiah, and everyone, Another thing I ment to ask is, What direction was the vibration axis, vert; or horizontal, or was it at an odd angle? I have read that its the gas given off of the battery that corrodes and rusts metals, Just look at any old truck or car, always rusted worse on the battery side of the vechicle. I'd like to do my battery recon. outside as well, but for now everything is inside the shop. I have'nt tried the "hammer or dropping" method, yet...but I did have a battery yesterday that was makeing the big charger's amp guage flip all over the place back and forth...shut it down rightaway. Turns out that one cell was shorted intermittedly...a likely candidate for an explosion event. I also have taken the factory sealed caps off of a few other batteries, thanks for the tips on this. ....Mac46 I'm just a farmer |
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