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Forum Index : Windmills : Miller Rotor
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MacGyver Guru  Joined: 12/05/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 1329 |
Gizmo Just looking at this thing, if you were to slap the two "blades" together and pivot it at the same center, it would be just like the signs we call "wind spinners" here in the States. Does this spin counter-clockwise looking down from the top? That's the way a wind spinner would spin (I think!) Edit: I'm curious now if doing what I've suggested would make the new one spin the same as the old one. If it does, I'd make it out of film-covered foam sheet to make it light and strong and make it as big as I could. Just a thought. Edit: Here's a Link for an example of what I'm talking about. By the way, I think the girl in the video is spinning the thing opposite to the way the wind would! . . . . . Mac Nothing difficult is ever easy! Perhaps better stated in the words of Morgan Freeman, "Where there is no struggle, there is no progress!" Copeville, Texas |
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| turnymf Regular Member  Joined: 04/10/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 84 |
How about stacked millers? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AEuWf95B0w Starts easier....but still not sure whats really happening |
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| MacGyver Guru Joined: 12/05/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 1329 |
[Quote=turnymf]How about stacked millers? I viewed the video and stopped it to see the configuration of the ends of the wings, but don't see the bends. I'm thinking this is something else. Also, "it appears" that a motor is driving it and not wind! . . . . . Mac Edit: Quoted part Nothing difficult is ever easy! Perhaps better stated in the words of Morgan Freeman, "Where there is no struggle, there is no progress!" Copeville, Texas |
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retepsnikrep Senior Member  Joined: 31/12/2007 Location: United KingdomPosts: 131 |
I'm a bit confused with the figures. If we have 1M square vanes are we saying the distance between them should be 1.618M? So if we had 2M square vanes they should be 3.236M apart? Or is the ratio of the width to the height of a vane 1.618? So if vane is 1M wide it should be 1.618M high? Does the height of the vanes matter? Sorry if i'm being thick? Gen1 Honda Insights. |
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| turnymf Regular Member Joined: 04/10/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 84 |
I viewed the video and stopped it to see the configuration of the ends of the wings, but don't see the bends. I'm thinking this is something else. Also, I'm pretty sure a motor is driving it and not wind! . . . . . Mac No motor Mac Just cds, beer bottle lids, bicycle spokes and cardboard stuck together with hot glue 
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| turnymf Regular Member Joined: 04/10/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 84 |
The vane ratio is 1.6 high, 1 wide The distance between the vanes is variable Closer =easier start farther =torque |
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| turnymf Regular Member Joined: 04/10/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 84 |
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaVytZD5g1M Here is one with bent vanes sat next to a sav Using 3 vanes helped it start so didn't bother to bend them Rough models I know, but you get the idea |
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| clarence Regular Member Joined: 27/10/2006 Location: Posts: 63 |
what a really simple vawt. I wacked one together in about 10 mins with a bike wheel and plastic panels cut out of 20l drum, and it works! quite torquey too. It just "doesnt look" like it should work but it does. Great stuff. |
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| clarence Regular Member Joined: 27/10/2006 Location: Posts: 63 |
@ RonS, in your trials did you ever try stacking another miller on top offset 90 degrees for easier starting and leave all panels flat? If so how did it go? clarence. |
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| MacGyver Guru Joined: 12/05/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 1329 |
To bring a little balance to this topic, I jammed one together too and mine just sat there and mocked me; never turned! I'll leave it for some heavier wind before turning it into a paper weight. . . . . . Mac Nothing difficult is ever easy! Perhaps better stated in the words of Morgan Freeman, "Where there is no struggle, there is no progress!" Copeville, Texas |
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| turnymf Regular Member Joined: 04/10/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 84 |
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TSMGjyN4GRM Miller outside, slightly bigger These millers really do fly once they are rotating gotta go bigger... |
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Gizmo Admin Group  Joined: 05/06/2004 Location: AustraliaPosts: 5078 |
Hey Macgyver The Miller should start up easily in light winds. Did you add the little bend at one end of each wing? Glenn The best time to plant a tree was twenty years ago, the second best time is right now. JAQ |
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| MacGyver Guru Joined: 12/05/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 1329 |
Gizmo I think maybe I have the rotors too close together. I used a circular aluminum platform I'd already spun up on the lathe for another project and it was kinda small. It came with a 5/16" hole and set screw already installed, so I grabbed it. I haven't trashed it yet; and yes, I put the little bend at the end of each blade, but my bend is flat and now that I look, the ones made by others are slightly curved. Don't know if that matters. I'm okay with all this though. I only built it to get it out of my system. I've "officially" sworn off VAWTs in favor of HAWTs. Even as I sit here at my computer, the leaves in the trees are more or less motionless, yet my 1-meter 3-blade HAWT spins lazily (no load) out by the greenhouse. That's what I mean; HAWTs just work better. Still,there's that little voice lurking in the recesses of my mind, saying "Try this!" Here's a slick video on what I'm hoping will be my last last VAWT build (unless it works really good, of course!)  Nothing difficult is ever easy! Perhaps better stated in the words of Morgan Freeman, "Where there is no struggle, there is no progress!" Copeville, Texas |
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| MacGyver Guru Joined: 12/05/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 1329 |
Color me stupid! There's absolutely no wind, but I strolled out to the greenhouse to check my maters and it hits me square in the face: I put the rotors on backwards! I had the little bent ends facing each other on the inside!!!! Makes a dandy wind vane that way, by the way! I'll give it a second go before I turn it into another fancy paper weight. Yikes! 
Edit: punctuation Nothing difficult is ever easy! Perhaps better stated in the words of Morgan Freeman, "Where there is no struggle, there is no progress!" Copeville, Texas |
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| clarence Regular Member Joined: 27/10/2006 Location: Posts: 63 |
Hopefully it should spin now MacGyver 
I am going to build a 1.2 metre square tin miller next. Probably use a car wheel and front bearing hub. my little plastic test miller spins about 140 rpm @ 20 k winds, but its very roughly built. |
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| turnymf Regular Member Joined: 04/10/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 84 |
Getting bigger, looking for comment http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SbBEpjCsWyY&feature=channel Anyone found out any more on this rotor? It definately wants the front peice I have tried different configs but the one mentioned by Ron seems to be near to the best( refering to one set of vanes) I have posted a few tests of a single pair of vanes on utube as well as a 3 tier stack It has just about out grown the shed and will have to sit on a trailer for a while I am to put another tier to make the stack 4 high, due to the J shape of the vane cheers |
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| jamiec Newbie  Joined: 21/07/2008 Location: AustraliaPosts: 3 |
Hi MacGyver have you tried the miller rotor again? I have searched the www and can not find much info on the miller rotor it seems very interesting. jamie |
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| clarence Regular Member Joined: 27/10/2006 Location: Posts: 63 |
very interesting indeed. Thanks turnymf for putting in the work with testing. I was kind of curious about the science behind the 1.6 ratio regarding efficiency. does anyone have an explanation? |
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| MacGyver Guru Joined: 12/05/2009 Location: United StatesPosts: 1329 |
jamiec I think my interest in VAWTs has run its course. I love the idea. Unfortunately, they just don't have enough consistent power for me to spend much time on them. I'm sticking to my up-wind, three-blade, Stuart-type mill with either solid or hollow aluminum blades and a generator of my own design (which also doesn't work yet!!). Hey, that's what this is all about, right? If it all worked out the first time, there'd be a whole crew of old, fat and BORED guys sitting in their garage shops wondering what to do. If I could actually understand how the "Windspire" works, I might invest some interest in making one, but all the symmetric-section blades I've manufactured just sit on the VAWT and mock me. Nothing ever turns unless I tweak it and make it be a "drag" unit, but that's not what I'm after. There's just no way, as I see it, to improve the swept area of a HAWT using vertical blades; just isn't in the cards. Nothing difficult is ever easy! Perhaps better stated in the words of Morgan Freeman, "Where there is no struggle, there is no progress!" Copeville, Texas |
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| clarence Regular Member Joined: 27/10/2006 Location: Posts: 63 |
I cant give up on vawts MacGyver, I have the vawt bug atm, perhaps it will pass I know they are usually slow and inefficient but I intend to go bigger bigger until I get something to produce useful power. Great big hawts are too scary for me. Little hawts are not much good in 10kmph winds but huge vawts can be useful in low winds, or I hope I manage to build one big enough to be useful one day.
clarence. |
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