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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : [MM] 3 bit colo(u)r MaxiMite
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Nick Guru  Joined: 09/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 512 |
This is great! So many colour mods on the cards! May the best mod win! And the best mod should have a write up in Silicon Chip Magazine so it becomes the "official" colour mod for the Maximite. We don't want a mish-mash of mods but a "standard" that programmers can use as an official colour reference to create software. The criteria should be... 1) Integrates relatively seamlessly into the Maximite environment. 2) Easy to install/implement into the existing Maximite and clones. Nick |
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MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
I am not a game developer so my question comes out of ignorance. :) If i take maxman like an example would the process be: 1) create background (the maze) 2) draw the moving/changable parts (the dots, ghosts, score) 3) establish/calculate what needs to be displayed 4) goto 1 sequence 1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,etc.. or is step 1 drawn once and the sequence is like 1,2,3,4,2,3,4,2,3,4,etc and only when new background is needed start with step 1. i could imagine that storing a background seperate and drawing only what is needed would make a addon through a serial io possible because only changes are send and it might be fast enough. Having two overlapping memories like 4 bits for background, 4 bit for foreground )one of them transparent) then outputing the 8 bits to a vga screen. If through serial is too slow the only other way is parallel btu for that you would need at least 18 address bits and 8 bits data (26 i/o ports). I saw that the pic 32 has parallell output port capabilities and even through dma to do the data transfer without using cpu. Unfortunately for that a 100 pin version is necessary. Anyone know the maximum throughput for the pic32 to a serial device i2c, uart etc.. only drawback would be price, because for the number of components needed you can just buy a raspberry and have hdmi. Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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| Nick Guru Joined: 09/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 512 |
TZAdvantage: Yes. You need to devote code for each moveable item and include an AI that may be necessary for the computer controlled objects. Also, the code needs to be written so only 1 frame of animation occurs through each pass of this "game loop". You are in essence creating a multi-tasking process. The only parts that would be slow via serial I guess is the drawing and, I haven't looked at the data sheets in detail but if this serial VGA has things like sprites and possibly a blitter, then that speeds things up a fair bit because you would only need to send instructions to these and they carry out the hard work. Certainly, games that don't involve too much realtime animation such as board games or turn based games should be no problem. Nick |
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| mookster1 Regular Member  Joined: 10/06/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 81 |
I understand there is quite a difference as to how the standards work, but how easy would it be to have colour composite video as well as VGA? Capacitance is futile - roll on 2012! |
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jman Guru Joined: 12/06/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 711 |
Correction I meant to say The hardware mod is NOT difficult to do It does require the removal and refitting of the VGA connector to cut the tracks on pins 1-2-3 Pics attached 
John |
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| Nick Guru Joined: 09/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 512 |
A lot of fine soldering near the PIC chip pins. Will need steady hands or you could botch up your PIC32. Not an impossible mod but I can see some bunged up Maximites out there after the mod. Maybe someone can offer a service to do this upgrade professionally? This is why I was hoping that I/O pins from the back connector could be "reprogrammed" in the Maximite video driver firmware to output the RGB via an external connector when using colour. Nick |
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Geoffg Guru Joined: 06/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 3194 |
I have been experimenting with this technique for generating colour and the results are amazing. It is just too good to ignore. John did an excellent job of converting his Maximite but he must be expert at desoldering as removing the VGA connector is an almost impossible task without damaging the board. Because of this I doubt that few would want to mod their existing Maximites (or DuinoMites). So, to get colour, we will need a new PCB and if we do that we might as well go with a new Maximite (the Mark II Colour Maximite). The other issue is that colour requires three SPI channels and on the 64 pin chip this means that one channel has to be shared with the SD card and this causes interference on the screen when the SD card is accessed. The 100 pin chip has four SPI channels so, if we are going with a new board, we might as well go with the 100 pin chip - it is only 90 cents more expensive than the 64 pin chip and it will not break the bank. I have the design and the colour version of MMBasic mostly finished. It will do everything the original Maximite did (with the exception of composite video) and will run almost as fast. Because of the 100 pin chip we also have extra I/O so I plan a second 26 pin connector giving a total of 40 I/O pins. It should cost about the same as the original Maximite and be capable of being built by a home constructor. I presume that Silicon Chip will publish the design but it will take some months for the article to appear as I have to design the new board, get them made, build the prototypes, write the articles, etc. So, hang in there... the Colour Maximite is coming and you too will be able to program in glorious colour. Geoff 
Geoff Graham - http://geoffg.net |
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| jman Guru Joined: 12/06/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 711 |
FANTASTIC |
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| Nick Guru Joined: 09/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 512 |
I second that... Fantastic! While you're at the design stage, how about making the sound outputs more accessible by actually providing a jack to connect the audio ouput to an amp or the monitor's audio in jack's (many LCD monitors already have audio in). And to take this even further, a second small pic chip programmed as a sound chip with it's own Internal RAM to hold Musical notes or simple sound samples that can be played with zero intervention of the main PIC and MMBasic. Granted, this may be beyond the scope of what the Maximite is aimed to be... a games machine... and will add cost (maybe provided a socket for this extra PIC as an audio upgrade?). Nick |
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vasi Guru Joined: 23/03/2007 Location: RomaniaPosts: 1697 |
Maybe it would be easy to develop a MMBasic version on this board for game programmers/users... Hobbit name: Togo Toadfoot of Frogmorton Elvish name: Mablung Miriel Beyound Arduino Lang |
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| Nick Guru Joined: 09/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 512 |
Wow! Here's another idea. How about a maximite 2 board that installs into the base of a keyboard? It would require a keyboard that has enough open space inside. Unfortunately, keyboards today are quite slim but older ones tended to have a bit of space at the bottom and by cutting a panel at the back, could make room for connectors. The idea would be to reduce desktop clutter and have a self contained computer/controller keyboard. Just an idea. |
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| Nick Guru Joined: 09/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 512 |
And another idea... Update the.. "Colour Maximite MMBasic Version 4.0" boot text to a proper and official boot logo that comes up when the maximite is powered up. Display it for 2 seconds then jump to the command prompt (or simple file menu?). Nick |
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| jman Guru Joined: 12/06/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 711 |
This would my desk worse as I very seldom use a keyboard on my Maximite. The current PCB size is good for embeded applications. I assume that's the reason for the I/O ports and built in protocols (SPI,I2C,Serial) This is my opinion and I expect everbody has their own John |
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| cosmic frog Senior Member  Joined: 09/02/2012 Location: United KingdomPosts: 284 |
....and can we also have a BLITTER chip with 3d graphics and quadrophonic sound and matter transmogrifier with built-in time machine and.... Just kidding 
This is great, and the colour text from Geoff looks fantastic, but lets not turn this great little computer into something that its not. Lets get the colour working properly and then move onto the 3d graphic and whatever. Again, this looks FANTASTIC! |
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djuqa Guru Joined: 23/11/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 447 |
What would be great especially for some of the embedded applications is to have something like what is used with the Duinomite regular & Mini Maximite. Have a separate add-on board(s) for the IO connectors including the KB. That way it would be more flexible in the usage. But number 1 criteria should be to keep the overall design "SIMPLE". This whole project/ design paradigm is not to re-create a Desktop Computer with all that entails, but a simple & powerful control/trainer/embedded/useful computer with easy to use Firmware/Hardware. VK4MU MicroController Units |
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| Geoffg Guru Joined: 06/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 3194 |
On the audio front I hope to have two PWM outputs available which could be used for stereo sound with a future firmware upgrade. If there is space on the back panel I will also add two RCA connectors although this is not a priority. One thing that I have to be careful of is that if I add a $5 part it will add $20 to the cost of a kit due to the price multipliers that operate. For this reason I am trying to make any extras optional. I am also trying to make all the parts (including the box) generic so that anyone can produce a kit and hopefully the resultant competition will keep the price down. Vasi, that is a neat board. There are so many great PIC32 platforms out there that it makes it difficult to decide what to support with MMBasic and what to ignore. A small logo is a good idea... now to design a logo !!! Geoff Geoff Graham - http://geoffg.net |
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| jman Guru Joined: 12/06/2011 Location: New ZealandPosts: 711 |
@Geoff If space on the backpanel is tight maybe a 3.5mm Stereo socket would do the trick John |
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bigmik Guru Joined: 20/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2914 |
Gee, I go off air for one day and see what happens... Wow looks fantastic Geoff. I cant wait to get one in the flesh. Of course we could always run the extra wires to `other/unused' pins on the VGA socket and then make a simple M-F adapter that plugs into the VGA socket and swaps the pins back to their correct posititions for the monitor... this adapter can even have the diodes and resistors mounted in it so the only difficult part is soldering to two (is it only two) pic pins... Regards, Mick Mick's uMite Stuff can be found >>> HERE (Kindly hosted by Dontronics) <<< |
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| Nick Guru Joined: 09/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 512 |
Blitters, sprites? All possible when you remember that all this is created within software. Only limitations are whether there will be enough speed in the PIC32, RAM overheads and whether this is the direction the Maximite should take. It's up to Geoff. There are lots of competator boards coming out, just trying to offer suggestions that will help it stay in the race. I agree, a 3.5mm jack would be better than 2 x RCA's because that means it's the same as a PC. Most LCD monitors connect to the PC with a 3.5mm to 3.5mm stereo jack on each end. The 2 x RCA'2 is usually used for connection to a HiFi system. This is less likely than the LCD monitor. The 3.5mm jack also takes up less space. As for the Logo, I'm working on one... Geoff: Is it possible to include an intesity control to the colour mapping? 8 colours doubles to 16 much like the old EGA colour use to be. If Geoff can keep the colour MMBasic compatible with the B/W MMBasic, that would be good. I'm considering another game and would like to make it so it supports the colour but I would like it to work on the "older" unit with very little (or no) modification. I agree regarding the Maximite in a keyboard (what was I drinking!?). It's of no use to those that use the Maximite without the keyboard. But.. maybe design the board in such a way so that the PCB could be mounted within a suitable keyboard for anyone feeling adventurous. 
Nick |
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| centrex Guru Joined: 13/11/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 320 |
As this mod requires joining pins 8,21 & 43 does this mean that I2C would not work as pin 43 is used as the data line for I2C. cliff Cliff |
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