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Forum Index : Windmills : Stub axles for Smart drive VAWT
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| Stephenj Newbie  Joined: 05/07/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 13 |
Hi Guys, I like the idea of using stub axles for VAWT's, they seem pretty strong. Ives looked at a trailer parts catalogue and some of the stubs outside diameter are 45mm and the stators inside diameter is 45mm (on a 60 series) I don't as yet have a welder and no machining equipment, just a grinder... So my question is, has anyone come across any stub axles that "bolt on" with little modifications necessary? Obviously some modifications are still required. I'm also not sure about the rotor modifications involved, I think if I was to cut a hole in a rotor I'd find it difficult to get it aligned/centralised properly..? I have looked at a few of these projects on this site. Cheers Stephen |
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Madness Guru  Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498 |
Have you seen this method to setup a smart drive motor. Stub axles are robust and used in the Piggot generators but would be rather difficult to adapt a smart drive to it. There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't. |
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| Stephenj Newbie Joined: 05/07/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 13 |
I see Bob has used a hub of some kind for his rotor, this looks like the bees knees to me (but I know nothing about these things). it looks pretty fool proof / bullet proof, I'm sure it performs well too..? is it just a matter of glueing the ?Neo? magnets inside the hub..? Im gonna pop down to pick a part and have a peruse at hubs and stubs anyway :) 
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| Stephenj Newbie Joined: 05/07/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 13 |
Found a drum with 261.5mm ID, with magnets attached it might be 1mm too tight (or maybe bang on) from a Nissan Serena van. an axle from a Nissan Axis but its way off and would involve machining.. I think I've just blown $50 bucks, and three days of my life. Has anyone built a single stator F&P HAWT with blades attached to the rotor..? I think I should just keep it simple this time around. something for low winds that doesn't involve de cogging.. something for the entry level windmill enthusiast..?? Cheers |
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| Madness Guru Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498 |
Why not just use the original bearing setup? That would be quick, simple and cheap. Attaching blades to the rotor is not a good idea, find a suitable size pulley to fit onto the F&P shaft, then bolt your blades to it. There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't. |
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| Stephenj Newbie Joined: 05/07/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 13 |
Ok thank you, so you're saying set up a plate and blades on the other end of the F&P spline? And I could used the original F&P casing and bearings, but I think I'll be able to fabricate a steel mount for the bearings instead. I find there's a lot of resistance with the original bearings in that plastic casing too.. Cheers |
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| Madness Guru Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498 |
If you are setting out to build a wind generator for little money that is not mission critical. I would use the standard bearings, you can make very strong by removing all the plastic and you will find with minimal grinding the aluminium bearing casing will fit into a piece of square steel tube. Once you have welded everything to the steel put the aluminium housing inside and fill it with resin. Yes I did mean put the hub for the blades on the other end of the spline. If you are after a very quick and easy set of blades search around for how to make them out of PVC pipe, they are not perfect but a very good start. There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't. |
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Tinker Guru Joined: 07/11/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1904 |
Did you remove the bearing seal? this may cause a lot of drag. If the bearings are still hard to turn replace them, there are detailed instructions how to do that somewhere on the back shed site. Klaus |
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| Stephenj Newbie Joined: 05/07/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 13 |
Awesome thanks guys, I removed the seals from the bearings and it made a big difference. and I didn't realise the aluminium went right thru, that's a good idea. Im keen to put a quicky together while I have the time, then I will get into the nitty gritty later on. I also totally forgot about these instructions in my excitement too, duh.. http://www.thebackshed.com/Windmill/fp2a.asp Thank you |
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| Madness Guru Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498 |
If I where you I would take the time to grind down the stator to reduce cogging otherwise you need a fair bit of wind to get it started. There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't. |
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| Stephenj Newbie Joined: 05/07/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 13 |
will do, cheers. I was thinking about how to remove the the plastic from the shaft then I did something stupid and probably lost a few brain cells in the process. 
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| brucedownunder2 Guru Joined: 14/09/2005 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1548 |
Actually Steve, that came out pretty nice and clean .. Can you describe what you did,pls. Bruce Bushboy |
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| Madness Guru Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498 |
Yeah you should do that outside, the gasses of that would be nasty. I took it off using a 1mm thick cutting disc in the grinder to get the bulk off them used a old screw driver to punch the wedge shaped bits out. I am not sure but maybe a hot oven would do the job. There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't. |
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| Tinker Guru Joined: 07/11/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1904 |
Well, looking at the first picture my guess would be a blowtorch 
While the result looks nice and clean now it certainly would not be as strong as it was when at least some plastic was in between the alu ribs. Pressing in the bearings might seriously distort the alignment of the two bearings unless the lot is somehow carefully fitted into a new housing first - RHS tubing perhaps. Leaving the plastic in situ and only shaping it either square or round, depending into what it is going to fit, is a better idea and that is what most F&P windmill builders appear to do. Klaus |
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| Madness Guru Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498 |
I have done this a few times, the bearings are not a very tight fit so there is no problems refitting them. Once the whole lot is in RHS tube and filled with resin it is very solid, probably much more than the original plastic. The aluminium must be an alloy as it is quite strong on it's own too. There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't. |
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BobMann Senior Member  Joined: 30/06/2011 Location: United StatesPosts: 134 |
Hello what do,s (bees knees to me) mean?? The drum is from a trailer setup you will need to have the drum turned at the auto shop like.050 ths. But I think you would do better to us this stock Smart Drive setup I build. 
Here it is from the side 
Here it is from the top 
I use the trailer hub with out a brake drum its drag from the bearing is 1/2 the drag of the stock F&P bearings and can be adjusted and regreased over time. Doing it this way there is like zero cogging with the 60 stator. Building this way you can swap out stator on the fly with out taking the hub apart. Here is steve testing one of my Mann Smart Drives with the news MPPT MPPT Testing It has been a long and hard road for Steve and me on this project but I think it will work for all. Bob Mann |
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| Madness Guru Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498 |
bees knees, same as the ducks nuts, Rip Snorta, Mickey Mouse, all means looks pretty good mate. There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't. |
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| Stephenj Newbie Joined: 05/07/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 13 |
Thanks guys, and thanks Bob for your photos its the bees knees and totally bullet proof :) I had fun over the break, I was powering bulbs and the radio just by spinning the rotor by hand. I was getting 14-18v DC 1-2amps.I made some blades out of PVC too thanks to the online blade calculator. 
I thought Id ask another question instead of clogging up the forum with Newbie questions.. I have no access to CAM or CNC / metal band saws at present, although I like the idea of sourcing stuff on the cheap to see how cheaply I can put together a wind turbine so my question is, does anyone know of a female fitting (industrial/automotive, whatever) to fit over the end of the shaft? I had a look at a few of my sockets, they didn't fit properly of course but something along those lines.. or is there anything off the shelf that might fit over it?? BTW whats the correct terminology for the machining at the end of the shaft..? Cheers Stephen |
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| Madness Guru Joined: 08/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2498 |
The end of the shaft has spline on it, a simpler and cheaper way to fit a hub is to use the 25 mm round part of the shaft just behind the spline. You could either use a pulley off the shelf or get a hub machined out of steel. Drilling a hole straight threw the hub and shaft and putting a bolt in the hole and a nut on the other side will stop it going anywhere. I have used my 1/2 inch drill in low gear to drive shaft directly for testing the generator. Although I found just 1 phase at a time is all the drill could comfortably handle. BTW you can cut off the end of the aluminium housing where the seal was fitted, this will give you more shaft to work with. There are only 10 types of people in the world: those who understand binary, and those who don't. |
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| brucedownunder2 Guru Joined: 14/09/2005 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1548 |
Somewhere in this section is a female spline that fits the F&P shaft. From memory(haha,what memory), it's a toyota corolla or something like that .The end of the clutch housing , I beleive.. I once spent 2hours rat ing through a small car wrecker at brookvale on the north shore -he had hundreds of clutches, gearboxes, tailshafts,uni joints --all those have spline drive --go take a look ,but do a search here first. Bruce Bushboy |
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