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BenandAmber Guru Joined: 16/02/2019 Location: United StatesPosts: 961
Posted: 06:34am 21 Feb 2019
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Big question it may be true or it might just be another one of those wives tale please do not get mad at me I respect everyone of you guys and I know that our future is in your guys's hands but since I have the opportunity I have to ask do some Engineers get paid to make stuff to break after a certain amount of use or time again please take this lightheartedly I mean no offense or disrespect by it and like I said I do know theimportance of Engineers our future will be quite Bleak without you guys thanks again for all your helpEdited by BenandAmber 2019-02-22be warned i am good parrot but Dumber than a box of rocks
mackoffgrid Guru Joined: 13/03/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 460
Posted: 07:44am 21 Feb 2019
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Gday B&A You're dead right, Engineers and Scientists are crucial to the survival of our society.
As for designed in Obsolescence, I think you'll find managers are the instigators of this - the engineers do as they are told. You could say that competitive markets are also the driver of this outcome.
BenandAmber Guru Joined: 16/02/2019 Location: United StatesPosts: 961
Posted: 11:17am 21 Feb 2019
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I think that most of our future problems will be figured out in places just like this wher the great minds of the world are able to come together and bounce ideas off each other with no boss breathing down there back time deadline and profit in mind the true heroes of the world get no credit for their hard work brilliant ideas this is true peer-to-peer review of each others ideas the world better wake up and realized the benefit of these people because we lose more and more of them every day remember we see so far because we stand on the shoulders of giants It is truly amazing how freely these people give there lifelong collection of knowledge to others gladly without wanting anything in return in a world where everything is upside down and backwards it's really refreshing to find people that care about others so giving and helpful if everyone in the world had this same attitude there would be no war no hunger no poverty a true Utopia I'm sure everybody already knows but I'd like to State it here anyway these people get paid a lot of money for what they do free here thanks again it would give me joy if I could find a way to help in any way Edited by BenandAmber 2019-02-22be warned i am good parrot but Dumber than a box of rocks
LadyN Guru Joined: 26/01/2019 Location: United StatesPosts: 408
Posted: 07:28pm 21 Feb 2019
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The people here are brilliant at worst and geniuses at best.
They want nothing in return for the hours of help and guidance they provide. Did you look at the responses in the latest threads I posted to?
It is simply amazing.
I think a few members here (I am not going to name names) have had their ideas stolen and used in commercial products. Some of them know about it and have commented on this forum and elsewhere. I am not comfortable with that idea and will never purchase products from the companies that have been discovered to do this.
Which is why I am actually forced to build the inverter myself because it came to my attention that one of the inverter companies that also sells in the U.S. used ideas from atleast two members on this forum and gave them nothing in return.
I will not support such companies.
I am confused why there is no list of such bad companies in the first place. They must be punished.
I will do my part in learning the most from this forum and building little building blocks that are well tested and going to be long lasting
I THANK everyone on this forum
Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9308
Posted: 05:40am 22 Feb 2019
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I suppose it is certainly possible that some things are designed like that, but I don't think any self-respecting engineer could design for things to fail, as they don't want the wrath of upper-management or clients if something does not have a reasonable lifespan. Most engineers spend a good deal of time trying to keep old industrial technology working so clients are not forced into upgrading - something that can cost tens of thousands(or more) for some stuff.Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops!
Warpspeed Guru Joined: 09/08/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 4406
Posted: 06:07am 22 Feb 2019
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I remember my rather young engineer superior telling me when he first joined the company he was summoned into a meeting with the company owner and sales/marketing manager.
Was then informed that "we" are designing a new product and it needs a circuit board and it must be absolutely dirt cheap to make. So he gave them exactly what they asked for. At the end of the production line during final test only nine out of ten boards worked. All the failed boards had to have parts swapped around selectively to get them working. A very costly and inefficient method. But management did not care. The boards were cheap to make and that was all that mattered to them.
Another crazy example was an expensive product I designed that had a voltage reference chip and a couple of resistors. I ordered in some 22K 1% metal film resistors for production.
Our purchasing manager went to the Boss and said we already have 5,000 22K resistors in stock WTF ? So the Boss came in and gave me a rocket. Yelling and shouting, waving his arms around.
I said those 5% carbon resistors were not going to be good enough. Use the bloody resistors we already have he said. So we did. Saved the company about $3.00
Lots of complaints from customers, our service guy was running around in circles trying to fix the voltage drift. He went and saw the Boss about all those crap resistors production were using. The Boss certainly did not like my answer....
I could go on and on about really stupid ignorant egotistical people in management positions. Cheers, Tony.
LadyN Guru Joined: 26/01/2019 Location: United StatesPosts: 408
Posted: 06:28pm 22 Feb 2019
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I am very lucky that I will never have to worry about these terrible things because the doctors gave me 8 years to live when I was 5 and now I'm 14 so I have no misgivings that I am running on borrowed time.
I have the ability to do exactly what I want and exactly the way I want it and with you all I am learning more than I ever could.
My brother works in construction and he's constructing homes as we speak. These homes will cost millions of dollars but they will be damp and full of mold because:
1. It's raining a lot now 2. Construction company will not put up a roof until the rooms are completed because that increases costs 3. Rainwater is getting in everywhere 4. They will start to slowly rot the wood and cause mold 5. Construction company does not care because they will paint all over it and the issues will show up a decade or so later when the warranty runs out
I cannot imagine paying millions of dollars for a home. Second, I cannot imagine living in a damp and moldy house I paid millions of dollars for.
It's crazy. People have no idea what they are being handed.
Warpspeed Guru Joined: 09/08/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 4406
Posted: 10:07pm 22 Feb 2019
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I am retired and out of it now, but over many years I have slowly watched greed, evil, secrecy, and corruption spread throughout all of society at every single level. Its still getting worse and becoming less easy to conceal. And its not fixable.
Crunch day is coming for all of us, and each of us already know which side we are on.Cheers, Tony.
mackoffgrid Guru Joined: 13/03/2017 Location: AustraliaPosts: 460
Posted: 10:19pm 22 Feb 2019
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+1 Tony
The race to the bottom is ever present everywhere you look, especially the last 20 years.
Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9308
Posted: 10:55pm 22 Feb 2019
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[Quote=Warpspeed]Our purchasing manager went to the Boss and said we already have 5,000 22K resistors in stock WTF ? So the Boss came in and gave me a rocket. Yelling and shouting, waving his arms around.
I said those 5% carbon resistors were not going to be good enough. Use the bloody resistors we already have he said. So we did. Saved the company about $3.00[/Quote]
That is just plain insane. All over three bucks?!???!
@ LadyN - I can only hope you will continue to post here for many more years to come. The strength in these forums, is that EVERYONE can add their own bit of knowledge to a thread, and it makes most if not all the threads here a veritable gold-mine of technical information.
With your list: #2 - Yikes! The normal procedure here(and I expect many other places), is foundation first, frame 2nd, ROOF THIRD. This then protects the structure from rain while they build the rest of it. Surely, even bean-counters can see why it needs to be done that way? Even painting over it later is redoing work already done, so you'd think they would not want to pay for the extra paint! Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops!
Warpspeed Guru Joined: 09/08/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 4406
Posted: 11:27pm 22 Feb 2019
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All true, and there is a larger picture to the whole thing.
The Father arrived in Australia as an Italian immigrant with absolutely nothing. The old man had guts, intelligence, integrity and real character, and he built up a family manufacturing business that eventually thrived.
His worthless son grew up in a moderately wealthy household, and had none of the character of his father. Eventually the old man retired and handed control of the company to the son. It was all down hill from there.
It was before my time there, but I heard that the old man actually kicked his son fair in the arse in front of the whole staff one day over something. There was also a photograph we all used to giggle about, the son dressed up in a miniskirt and fish net stockings....Cheers, Tony.
LadyN Guru Joined: 26/01/2019 Location: United StatesPosts: 408
Posted: 11:49pm 22 Feb 2019
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Ha ha!
When I was younger and healthier there was a guy just like that who would dress the same and also send me dresses to wear and send pictures of over Facebook. He looked very funny in those dresses and I really enjoyed it seeing a grown man like that. My father was very upset when he found out and took away my camera and I was not allowed to touch the mailbox any longer. That guy did nothing wrong but my father is suspicious of everyone.
Now I am old, ugly and do not find dresses interesting anymore.
Electronics and esp2/stm32 ARE WAY more interesting. And it takes a lot less time to have fun.
Of course!
I am trying my best to document little modules here that any future reader of this forum can build for their power electronics projects.
I got that idea from building little functions for the coding competitions we do at school to use within the team. We win prizes at a national level.
After those little modules are done, I will use them to build a Warpverter.
After that I might consider a OzInverter for fun.
Then we will see as atleast 2 years would have passed by! I sometimes have to go to the hospital weeks at a time and I hate it because I have to lie in a cold bed all day and it delays all my projects for months at a time and dad sometimes forgets to feed Gus and Gus falls sick then.
I think the same here.
I learn by observing my brother and his coworkers when dad is not home. It is very hard work and I wish I could help him but they make me sit very far away sometimes in his truck which is very boring.
Yes, framing is second and to make sure there is no downtime, the company brings the drywalls and framing supplies and keeps them near each house.
When it rains, all these drywalls and framing supplies get wet and start to mold. Any existing frames are wet as well and nooks and crannies gather water.
The workers like my brother are instructed to keep using these wet supplies and not to waste time drying things as it will delay schedule.
The owners of this company have made thousands of houses all over California and have started and closed multiple companies under different names during all this time to deny warranty claims.
No one asks who the developer of a house is when they buy a house. There is so much demand here in California that no one can afford to ask those questions.
I had an argument with my brother in 2013 when he was contracted by the current owners of the houses he helped build in 2004 to help fix the issues caused due to inferior materials.
I asked him to disclose to the owners everything that he had told me so they could get those fixed and he refused to do that. I was very upset. It was not right.
His excuse was that the decisions were not his and he had very little choice because both father and I were at hospital at that time.
I now understand that:
i. Those owners also did not care of the deep problems that hid in the home they lived in. They were just staying in the house hoping the property would appreciate so they could sell the house at a profit and hide the problems and make it someone else's problems ii. Those owners did not want to know about the deep problems because then they would have to disclose the issues to new owners which would affect the resale value iii. Those owners did not care about fixing the problems.
While it really is hard work, nothing my brother does is really complicated.
Any adult can do it if they want to.
It's not complicated.
Those owners did not want to do it.
They would spend weeks getting quotes from different workers like my brother, talking them down and often finally not pay what was agreed on. They would try cancel projects mid way.
If instead they spent the same time and energy fixing things themselves, they would have paid 80% of what they ended up paying and landed with higher quality work.
Kind of like the inverter landscape.
Which is why I have the utmost respect for you all here.
Instead of complaining how bad and crappy the inverters from China are, you all do it yourselves and solve the problem.
Sorry for the long post. I can type very fast because that's how I talk too. I currently have to type using a keyboard but there's a new system that uses a touchscreen where I can type with gestures but its very expensive. Actually that system was developed in Australia I think! Maybe one of you even help build it! nice!
Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9308
Posted: 06:15am 23 Feb 2019
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Remind me never to buy a house in California.... America has a reasonably strict building code, so I am surprised this has not been caught by the building inspectors during examination of the building progress.Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops!
Warpspeed Guru Joined: 09/08/2007 Location: AustraliaPosts: 4406
Posted: 06:31am 23 Feb 2019
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Ah, but the building inspector knows the secret handshake.Cheers, Tony.
Grogster Admin Group Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 9308
Posted: 06:41am 23 Feb 2019
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Oh.......... Smoke makes things work. When the smoke gets out, it stops!
Notice. New forum software under development. It's going to miss a few functions and look a bit ugly for a while, but I'm working on it full time now as the old forum was too unstable. Couple days, all good. If you notice any issues, please contact me.
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