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Forum Index : Windmills : connections 3 x cindys 2 kw
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| tomqu7 Senior Member  Joined: 09/11/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 168 |
so how do I connect what is best dc wire to use so fat wire 3 x cindys 2 kw and one beawindhog.com 4 kw the usa say i can mount it on a 3 inch pipe I have found an engineer who will increase my oresent plan fromm 9 metres to 40 metres re the pdf by enhar ( if u google small wind turbines and take the 4 th heading is pdf for victorian govt and go to page 30 ) |
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| brucedownunder2 Guru  Joined: 14/09/2005 Location: AustraliaPosts: 1548 |
Gee Tommie,, you're a bit off-frequency trying to work out what you are saying . Sorry ol chum , but thats a fact . And the way u are talking about 120 foot towers makes me shake a bit ... plus the 3x 4 Kw jobbies --wow ... Anyhow , you're having fun ,so go for it ,mate. Bruce. Bushboy |
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Gizmo Admin Group  Joined: 05/06/2004 Location: AustraliaPosts: 5078 |
Yeah Tom, not sure what the question is? Do you mean the tower guy wires, or the electrical wires? The best time to plant a tree was twenty years ago, the second best time is right now. JAQ |
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| tomqu7 Senior Member Joined: 09/11/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 168 |
I found an engineer to draw up plans for a 40 metre tower they have 10 draftsmen and do massive towers for the mining people and all sorts of communication towers I asked him to make it see saw or something to service turbines next I have to find help with the other stuff i need to get a separate meter for wind turbines or I will blow my PFIT tariff after I finally got a resolution to agl stuff up they may smell a rat if I put 10 kw of turbine thru the meter re u cannot do more panels then 5 kw to be in pfit scheme initially victorian govt said 10 kw in 2009 but changed so after reading the pdf by enhar entitled small windturbines it states not to skimp on towers and that u get 150% more energy with a 120 foot tower it is easy to get cranes for erection in narre warren vic I have a substation out front as block is factory block with 3 phase etc I am trying to get an electric vehicle conversion so substation will be handy for fast filler as I do 200 kms a day it is hard to find expertise in australia on anything, so i was grateful to find engineers who knew what I was talking about I have to work out what size copper wire the fabricator would not work without a plan and I have to get a building permit anyway I will have 3 of cindys 2 kw toy turbines and one 4 kw from beawindhog.com I have seen on some usa sites they use welding wire a guy on this site designed the square green thing for cindy i have a friends paddock but it flooded knee high in victorian floods so I do not know what the effect on the turbine wiring would be there are expensive turbines made for sea installation yes on the sea |
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| tomqu7 Senior Member Joined: 09/11/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 168 |
beawindhog.com are on utube I have a 4 kw turbine main body of theirs beawindhog state u can mount it on a 3 inch pipe so my project involves 3 of cindys 2 kw toy turbines and one 4 kw from beawind hog.com so I have tower covered and now have to work out wiring as gizmo said its a lot of copper wire |
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Downwind Guru Joined: 09/09/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2333 |
@Tom, Good to see you are taking your Meds or enabled spell check, or what ever to make your posts partly readable. I was the person who designed the "green thingy" for OEM (Cindy) and had given a recomendation of 16mm square copper area conductor per phase, for a basic 2kw mill at 9m allowing for some distance to the controller ( "green thingy" ). When you change the height and the distance between mill and controller, then the cable size (mm2 of copper) also changes to reduce cable loss due to resistance over total distance. 95% of the time the cable size will be far greater than required, but you need to design to the needs of the last 5% to extract max output and to have max control of the mill. Or to put it another way, if your cable is too small you wont get the same power out the end as you put into it, your losses will be higher in a smaller cable. Look up Ohms law, and copper cable resistance over distance, and do some calcs of your own on cable size and losses. Remember your dump load is a resistor, and if you add to much resistance in the cable prior to the dump load, then the mill cannot be fully controlled in high winds. Otherwise your question reads like...... what size wire do i need to power the space shuttle in orbit? Pete. Sometimes it just works |
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| tomqu7 Senior Member Joined: 09/11/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 168 |
thank you so is this correct R increases with length so if I have cable from the hub of turbine at 40 metres tower height I will overpower cindys green thing u designed there are a couple of posts on natural gas cars the problem all the natural gas facilities are owned by overseas companys who will export the gas onto the world market where they get a better price the manufacturers are very worried about securing gas so electric car seems to be best option where u can charge up from your solar garage gas prices are going to rise in melborune |
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| tomqu7 Senior Member Joined: 09/11/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 168 |
I = V/R volts = R x I I KNOW HOW DO CABLE IS The resistance, R, of a length of wire is described by the expression: R = ρL/A where ρ = resistivity of the material composing the wire, L = length of the wire, and A = area of the conducting cross section of the wire. THEE IS A CALCULATOR ON A SITE Closest AWG Metric mm2 Circular inch mm ohm/1000' ohm/km 21 0.50 986.8 0.0363 0.922 10.7290 35.200 18 0.85 1,677 0.0473 1.202 6.3094 20.700 17 1.25 2,467 0.0574 1.457 4.2977 14.100 15 2 3,947 0.0726 1.843 2.6792 8.790 13 3 5,921 0.0889 2.257 1.7861 5.860 11 5 9,868 0.1147 2.523 1.0729 3.520 9 8 15,788 0.1451 3.686 0.6706 2.200 5 20 39,471 0.2294 5.828 0.2679 0.879 ENTER Length in feet or meters Amps |
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| tomqu7 Senior Member Joined: 09/11/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 168 |
SO RESISTANCE FALLS WITH THE DIAM OF THE WIRE i USE 6 MM DC CABLE ON MY SOLAR PV PANELS( HAVE TO BUY FROM GERMAN COMPANY HUBER SCHNEIR) SO SAY I USE ???? i WILL HAVE 3 OF CINDYS 2 KW AND ONE 4 KW FROM BEAWINDHOG.COM IN A ROW SO WILL HAVE TO HAVE ONE BIG WIRE CONNECTING THEM Metric Stranded Copper Wire Resistance and Voltage Drop Size Diameter Resistance @ 77ºF Resistance for length (Ohms) Voltage Drop (Volts) Closest AWG Metric mm2 Circular mils inch mm ohm/1000' ohm/km 21 0.50 986.8 0.0363 0.922 10.7290 35.200 18 0.85 1,677 0.0473 1.202 6.3094 20.700 17 1.25 2,467 0.0574 1.457 4.2977 14.100 15 2 3,947 0.0726 1.843 2.6792 8.790 13 3 5,921 0.0889 2.257 1.7861 5.860 11 5 9,868 0.1147 2.523 1.0729 3.520 9 8 15,788 0.1451 3.686 0.6706 2.200 5 20 39,471 0.2294 5.828 0.2679 0.879 ENTER Length in feet or meters Amps The resistance, R, of a length of wire is described by the expression: R = ρL/A where ρ = resistivity of the material composing the wire, |
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| Downwind Guru Joined: 09/09/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2333 |
[quote]I will overpower cindys green thing u designed [/quote] Not exactly correct, the Green thing (controller) will be under powered (not over powered) as the cable resistance will prevent the controller dumping the full power the windmill produces. Think of the cable as a water pipe, and the windmill pumping water into a tank, the more the wind blows the more water the mill pumps, now if the pipe from the tank (cable) is too small or too long then the volume of water from the tank through the pipe, will be less then the volume of water the mill is pumping, so the tank overflows. (windmill runs away) What you want is a pipe (cable) big enough to handle the max output of the mill (easy enough) but as pipe is very costly, the bigger the pipe the greater the cost, so you need a pipe correct in size to suit the job, but without going too big to create unnecessary costs. You talk of 3 mills feeding into one larger cable, that wont work unless the larger cable is after each controller (green thing) So ...........one windmill............ 3 phase cable............... controller...........DC to bigger cable (3 mills)............... this will work. NOT......... one windmill..............3 phase cable ...............3 phase to bigger cable (3 mills)............... controller ................ this WILL NOT work Sometimes it just works |
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| tomqu7 Senior Member Joined: 09/11/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 168 |
THANK U i HAVE 3 OF CINDYS 2 KW EACH WITH ONE GREEN THING EACH THE 4 KW FROM BEAWINDHOG (SUSPECT TURBINE MADE AT ANTEROS POST RE HUYAYA FACTORY) HAS A CONTROLLER YOUR PLAN WOULD WORK IN THE REVERSE ORDER WOULD IT FOOTPRINT OF TURBINES (CINDY 2 KW---- CINDY 2 KW------ CINDY 2KW )--ONE BIG DC CABLE ---CONTROLLER**--3 PHASE CABLE --- BEAWIND HOG 4 KW HAVE TO GET ANOTHER METER ???? THAT IS A SECOND METER DO U KNOW HOW TO GET A SECOND METER FROM ELECTRICITY DISTRIBUTOR SO I NEED TO BUY 3 PHASE CABLE AND DC CABLE SO U PUT THE 3 X 2 KW ON ONE BIG CABLE ? *** DO i PUT A CONTROLLER ON EACH TURBINE I HAVE 2 TYPES OF CONTROLLERS CINDYS GREEN THINGS X 3 AND ONE BEAWINDHOG |
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| tomqu7 Senior Member Joined: 09/11/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 168 |
(CINDY 2 KW--GREEN THING-- CINDY 2 KW---GREEN THING--- CINDY 2KW ) GREEN THING --ONE BIG DC CABLE ---CONTROLLER**--3 PHASE CABLE --CONTROLLER OF - BEAWIND HOG 4 KW |
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| tomqu7 Senior Member Joined: 09/11/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 168 |
ALSO IN CINDYS BOX CAME A SMALL INVERTER TYPE BOX BUT IT IS NOT AN INVERTER WHAT IS THIS |
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| Downwind Guru Joined: 09/09/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2333 |
Ok, Perhaps i misunderstood the "Green thingy" you should have a controller and a dump load, and the green thing might be the dump load, and the inverter looking thing the controller. Take some photos so we know what you are talking about. Sometimes it just works |
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| tomqu7 Senior Member Joined: 09/11/2012 Location: AustraliaPosts: 168 |
IT IS A DYNAMIC BRAKING UNIT i HAVE 3 OF THESE ONE FOR EACH OF CINDYS TURBINES ONE OF THE TURBINES HAS AN OFF / SWITCH ATTACHED TO WIRE THAT COMES FROM ROTOR DYNAMIC BRAKING UNIT DOES NOT LOOK LIKE IT IS FOR OUTSIDE USE SO IF i HAVE TURBINES ALONG DRIVE DO U BRING THE WIRE FROM THE LAST TURBINE UPTO THE UNDERCOVER CONTROL BOX DO U PUT THE 3 RESISTORS AND BRAKING UNIT IN ONE PLACE UNDER COVER AND RUN WIRE TO THEM |
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| Downwind Guru Joined: 09/09/2009 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2333 |
You simply dont grasp how stuff works. And why are you >>>>> SHOUTING >>>>>> at me with capital text. All the control gear from Cindy is not suitable to be out in the weather and is intended to be used under protective cover. Each mill has its own controller and its own dump load, and each mill needs to be suitably wired to its own controller and dump load regardless of where each controller and dump load is located. The outputs of each controller can be connected together to feed to a common battery or inverter or what ever. Its best to keep the resistor dump load as close to the controller as suitable. (not lots of meters away) Sometimes it just works |
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