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Forum Index : Microcontroller and PC projects : Ir is working but not on sony tv
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| plasma Guru  Joined: 08/04/2012 Location: GermanyPosts: 437 |
Hi, I have a projekt with ir on micromite. For the hardware i use geoff 's manual . I build a receiver and a transmitter with two micromites. It works fine over a distance from 4m. All commands are Working if i use the receiver with my micromite.. But if ii use it with my sony tv the tv do nothing. I use a ir diode from an original remote. All commands i send are working fine with the micromite. I get the commands from the receiver and compare it with a sony ir list From the internet.iam 100% shure i send the right commands. Has anybody testet this scene? Mfg |
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| robert.rozee Guru Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 2350 |
unfortunately the micromite transmits with a 38kHz carrier, while the sony tv expects to see a 40kHz carrier. it kinda works (with reduced range) with a 40kHz sony remote and a 38kHz receiver on the micromite, but your problem suggests not so well with the numbers going the other way. the transmit carrier is set in software within the micromite, while the receive carrier is set within the little 3-pin receiver block. the choice of 38kHz was made because 38kHz 3-pin receiver blocks were much cheaper than 40kHz ones. your best hope is that, in the next release, geoff adds an option to switch between 38kHz and 40kHz transmit carriers. rob :-) |
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| plasma Guru Joined: 08/04/2012 Location: GermanyPosts: 437 |
Can a poke help here ? Geoff ! Please , please !! This and maybe Spi slave :) |
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atmega8 Guru Joined: 19/11/2013 Location: GermanyPosts: 722 |
There are several ways..... Use an external NE555 with 40khz Output and modulate it with the IR output of the mmite. You can also try to generate 40 khz Signal with mmite and switch it on/off with the IR output, external with a transistor, or Feed The Signal back to the mmite and switch on/off The 40 kHz ;-).. |
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Geoffg Guru Joined: 06/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 3196 |
I am not sure that this is a 40KHz vs 38KHz thing. When I did my testing I found only a small decrease in sensitivity because of the wrong frequency, not a complete failure to work. Plasma, you can test this by putting the 38KHz transmitter close to the Sony receiver and see if it then works. If it does not, that will indicate that something else is wrong. Geoff Geoff Graham - http://geoffg.net |
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| atmega8 Guru Joined: 19/11/2013 Location: GermanyPosts: 722 |
Ok, if you receive nothing with your Sony TV, i agree to Geoff. There must be another Problem. Does mmite receive commands when you use your original IR remote ? Do you have an Oszillograph? |
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| atmega8 Guru Joined: 19/11/2013 Location: GermanyPosts: 722 |
Maybe your internet Research IS wrong. Compare to this nice Site: IR |
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| Keith W. Senior Member  Joined: 09/10/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 118 |
Hi, I have used this protcol analyser. There are limitations but you will be able to monitor with it the signal from the Micromite vs the signal from your remote. It did not correctly decode the signals for me though. Worth a look. You do require an infrared transistor. The site is shown on the ABOUT. Hope that you can read it. www.ostan.cz 
Keith W. |
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| plasma Guru Joined: 08/04/2012 Location: GermanyPosts: 437 |
Hi , Beta 18. Same as yesterday. Micromite / micromite works , Sony remote / micromite works but Micromite / TV do nothing. I testet also some other Ir sending Led which i bought today. i testet the pin ( i use pin14) and the transistor switch with a normal led to see some Problems. Nothing all is working. the only thing i found is the ir send command isnt shut down the ir led ! i use a camera for this test. the ir led is allways on and i can see the modulation if the micromite sending a byte. maybe its a trigger low/high thing ? dunno . mfg |
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| atmega8 Guru Joined: 19/11/2013 Location: GermanyPosts: 722 |
Phase? Try to invert it with a Transistor |
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| plasma Guru Joined: 08/04/2012 Location: GermanyPosts: 437 |
ok the phase shift was my fault , sending between micromites are working . I teset the send commands also with my Sony Laser Disk , with my Tape Deck and again with the (new) Tv. i think its a bug . i create also a for next loop to send all commands for every device . id 1/6/16 command 0-127 . the range i test is 1 cm up to 4 m . Nothing . i use also akku as powerstation to cut a power source out. Nothing. Can anyone please make a test also . thx |
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| robert.rozee Guru Joined: 31/12/2012 Location: New ZealandPosts: 2350 |
if you are transmitting with the wrong carrier frequency (which the micromite is) it can't really be called a bug. the sony products are just acting as expected, rejecting a signal with the wrong carrier frequency. bear in mind, we have no idea how sony choose to filter the signal being received, that is a hidden part of the product design. for all we know they may be extracting the carrier and making a quite exact check that it is spot on. i believe geoff chose to use the sony codes simply because sony remotes were readily available and kinda worked ok with the cheaply available IR receiver modules even though the sony remote was a slightly different carrier frequency. there was no design decision to make the micromite specifically capable of controlling sony products that i am aware of, though that is for geoff to confirm as he so wishes. rob :-) |
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| plasma Guru Joined: 08/04/2012 Location: GermanyPosts: 437 |
yes you are right , Geoff is using Sony codes because its these codes are available. But Geoff said this have nothing todo with the carrier frequenz. i used the IR Analyzer from the link above ( thx Keith) . it gets the commands in 50%. in some loops the time for the bits are longer as for the recognized codes. time shifts a bit , maybe this have todo while micromite is running without a quartz. I mean remote a sony device with a Micromite is a cool thing and verry usefull. i know Geoff is really busy but if he build this in iam really happy. next days ill use a oszi for some new tests because i really wonder why the tv isnt starting. so i ask again if anybody can help here iam glad . thx |
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| WhiteWizzard Guru Joined: 05/04/2013 Location: United KingdomPosts: 2817 |
Hi Plasma Just an idea if you've not tried this already. What freq (CPU) are you running MicroMite at? The default is 40MHz. Try increasing it to max (CPU 48). Also try lower speeds (CPU 30, CPU 20, CPU10, CPU 5) - see if same results when using IR Analyser at these different speeds. WW For everything Micromite visit micromite.org Direct Email: whitewizzard@micromite.o |
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| Geoffg Guru Joined: 06/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 3196 |
To my mind the fact that it will not work at 1cm rules out the issue being caused by the different carrier frequency. As far as I know, all IR receivers use a bandpass filter and if the frequency is not spot on it will still get by but with reduced sensitivity. Your test at 1cm shows that sensitivity could not be the issue. Do you know exactly what codes your Sony products are expecting? I suspect that they are looking for 15 or 20 bit codes. Sony remotes can generate 12 bit codes which was the original standard and 15 and 20 bit codes which are the newer extended standard. The IR decoder in the Micromite will decode all of them but the IR SEND command will only send 12 bit codes. Rob is right, I intended that the IR SEND command would be used for Micromite to Micromite communications. It would be a side benefit if it was able to control a Sony product - but that is all. I guess that I could try to implement the 15 and 20 bit codes in the IR SEND command but it would have limited appeal and I don't have a lot of equipment to test them on. Also, if I do that, I should also implement NEC codes, Philips codes, etc, etc. I think that the best solution is to modify the manual to point out the limitations of the IR SEND command. But sorry Plasma, that will not help you. Geoff Geoff Graham - http://geoffg.net |
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| plasma Guru Joined: 08/04/2012 Location: GermanyPosts: 437 |
ok i think about an other solution for this case. |
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| plasma Guru Joined: 08/04/2012 Location: GermanyPosts: 437 |
Finally my Tv is shut on or off with the micromite Sony code ! iam happy with it because my project is now 100 % possible and i think i can show something cool next days. thx for all hints and help and thx geoff for this great little computer ! @Geoff let the manual stay , your code works fine for my tv ! where is no need to change anything. |
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MicroBlocks Guru Joined: 12/05/2012 Location: ThailandPosts: 2209 |
What did you change to make it work? Would like to learn from your experiences. Microblocks. Build with logic. |
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| plasma Guru Joined: 08/04/2012 Location: GermanyPosts: 437 |
i explain ecerything if iam 100% shure . need to make some tests with other devices , which iam stored yesterday in my garage after the " feeling like a noob " depression. please wait , i hope you understand this. |
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bigmik Guru Joined: 20/06/2011 Location: AustraliaPosts: 2914 |
Plasma, I too await your `revelations' with anticipation. Regards, Mick Mick's uMite Stuff can be found >>> HERE (Kindly hosted by Dontronics) <<< |
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