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joyt12k

Regular Member

Joined: 12/05/2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 49

Posted: 12:30pm 12 May 2009

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Hi. I'm having 1Kw of solar panels professionaly installed with a 1.5kw inverter, and want to build
a wind generator using an F&P motor. Can I use the solar
inverter? If I can, what happens if there is more than
.5Kw ? or maybe I should pay for an up grade to a 2Kw one, I don't want to store it in batteries.
Advice would be appreciated, thank you.

jasmine

Bolty

Regular Member

Joined: 03/04/2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 81

Posted: 01:56am 14 May 2009

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Hi Jasmine.
I am of the opinion that you may be better off keeping your solar and wind inverters separate. It can certainly be done combining turbine with solar, but the voltage characteristics of each source needs to be compatible. For example, most new pv installations work in the 200 volt DC range. To combine the output from a F&P would require a voltage boost circuit. These can be customized to the output voltage required for the inverter. However this requires considerable electronics knowledge. Also there is the issue of what you do to limit the maximum output voltage of the turbine/voltage boost combination. You definitely need some kind of controller device that clamps the output from the turbine, otherwise you will blow up your inverter. This occurs either in very strong winds, or even in moderate winds when the grid is unavailable, and there is nowhere for the turbine power to go, due to the inverter being disconnected. Under these circumstances excessively high voltage will occur, unless some form of controller is used.

In the case of a totally separate wind turbine/controller inverter circuit, things can be designed to match without the need for a voltage boost circuit. For example the Latronics PV1200 inverter accepts 48V up to 100V DC. You still must have a controller for this though!

In my case I have a dedicated PV1200 with a 48 volt controller and a 1kW 48 volt Chinese turbine. Because of where I live, I have insuffient wind to be anywhere economical. I think it will take about 40 years to pay for itself. So effectively, I have a very attractive ornament sitting above the end of our house. This was something of a disappointment to me, as I had thought that our place was windy. Little did I realize how much wind you really need to be worthwhile.

The moral of the story is to collect a large amount of wind data before you go for a wind system, unless you are happy for it to be an ornament, or if you are fascinated by the hobby (which I have become !)

In my case I am going to supplement my PV1200 input with some 72 volt PV panels. It will populated with an extra 1kW of panels. I will maintain the connection with the turbine, allowing it to slightly augment my RE energy. In this case it will require diode blocking between the PV panels and the wind turbine circuitry.

I hope that this information is of some help to you!

Good luck with your endeavours!

joyt12k

Regular Member

Joined: 12/05/2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 49

Posted: 09:42am 14 May 2009

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Thanks for the information Bolty.I have just checked
with the installer and, they use the Latronics PV1200
and they will be installing 6 panels=1Kw so I guess theres only 200 watts left, so maybe in the near future
I'll install another solar panel. But I'm still keen on
doing something with wind.
I've just been on ebay, and theres a SWEA grid tie inverter for $450 or for $550 a kit which also includes a blocking diod and dump load, but only 250 watts,so next question,could I use this, I don't know what the F&P puts out but these units are stackable, however my wife won't let me spend too much money. Can I use a charge controller to keep it down to 250 watts? I live in Perth on the escarpment and we have very strong easterlies everyday throughout summer, some of the gusts have blown down trees from time to time. If not
what can I do?

jasmine

Bolty

Regular Member

Joined: 03/04/2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 81

Posted: 10:18am 14 May 2009

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In view of the fact that you will be getting the Latronics, you could use an F&P to boost the solar, as the voltages are compatible, probably without using a boost circuit. You would still definitely need a controller, as the Latronics is rated at a maximum input voltage of 100 volts. I know that you can easily blow the inverter even if it only goes over 100 volts by only a small amount. This would be a cheaper way to get into low levels of wind power.

Latronics make a wind controller (TC48)that works reasonably well, and in theory should limit the output from the F&P to a maximum of 75 volts. At this voltage a bank of Mosfets fires, and shorts out the turbine. The RRP is $599 (I think), but I was able to pick one up for less than that from an Adelaide Natural Technology Centre. I have had a storm that damaged my TC48, but I have now modified it, and hopefully it will be more storm resistant. I have also reduced the wind speed at which my turbine furls, so hopefully it now tolerate storms. I have also been told that Latronics have since slightly modified the design of the TC48. I should add that I have no affiliation with Latronics, I just use their inverter and controller.

I am unaware of the inverter that you mentioned. I do know that there are grid connect inverters of around 250 watts available on Canadian Ebay. You should look at a separate post on that issue, as others and myself have expressed opinions about them!

Hope that helps!

joyt12k

Regular Member

Joined: 12/05/2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 49

Posted: 10:57am 14 May 2009

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Do you happen to know what sort of power a F&P can put out? (watts,amps and volts)
I really would like to feed back as much as I can to the grid, I've only just started to build it, so I suppose I'll have to wait till it's built.
As far as power is concerned, is the formular: Watts= Voltage X Amps?

jasmine

Bolty

Regular Member

Joined: 03/04/2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 81

Posted: 01:48pm 14 May 2009

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I have not used anything other than my Chinese 1 kW. I have read plenty about the F&P and I think that they can produce around 500 watts. Of course that all depends on the size of the blades, whether or not it is capacitively coupled etc. You should be able to get plenty of info on that if you read some of the postings on the windmills section. In particular I seem to remember that GWATPE has posted plenty of data on his in the capacitors posting.
For DC circuits the formula is correct. For AC you have to take into account the power factor (the phase relationship between voltage and current)

joyt12k

Regular Member

Joined: 12/05/2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 49

Posted: 01:02pm 18 May 2009

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Thanks for the information, will start building it in the next few weeks.

jasmine

joyt12k

Regular Member

Joined: 12/05/2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 49

Posted: 02:07pm 04 Jun 2009

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Have just about made all the parts, tomorrow will do the bearing housing. I happened to see a picture with 2 F&P's one in front of the other on the net the other day, just wondering if the cogging with two would be impossible to spin? Has anyone out there tried this arangement?

jasmine

marcwolf

Senior Member

Joined: 08/06/2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 119

Posted: 03:08am 10 Jun 2009

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Hi Jasmine
I will be in the same situation re a 1kw solar system, however the installet tells me that he will be installing a 2kw invertor.

Re the 200v input. That depends on how they wire the cells. 200v (all in series) is a little cheaper re the wiring as the cables from the solar cells do not have to carry as much current.
However you can get them to use a combination of parallel and serial connections to get a lower voltage but at a higher amperage.
I have asked if I can get a 48v setup so I can hook in a wind turbine.

Alternatly - one could always have a seperate invertor and feed both of their outputs into the grid.

Dave

Coding Coding Coding..
Keep those keyboards coding..
RAW CODE!!!!!

joyt12k

Regular Member

Joined: 12/05/2009
Location: Australia
Posts: 49

Posted: 12:55pm 02 Jul 2009

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I will setting up the wind generator this Saturday, to trial it. All that's left to do is alter the wiring on the coils, then I can check the output.
I still don't know weather to wire it up 12v 24v or 48v
I may pay the extra dollars and upgrade to a 2kw inverter.
How far away are you from installing yours Dave?
I have not yet received approval yet, for mine.

jasmine

laddertech

Newbie

Joined: 25/02/2008
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1

Posted: 08:32pm 22 Mar 2011

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Gents the stackable Swea inverter is ideal for these types of connections for wind and solar. It is fully legal in Australia, RECS rebate approved and for sale at www.laddertech.com.au.

Green Power for the People!

KarlJ

Guru

Joined: 19/05/2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 1178

Posted: 10:00pm 22 Mar 2011

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Thanks Laddertech

the specs on your site are pretty vague and there have been a few of us who have tried similar alternatives -which have failed.

Personally I'd be happy if you were to post some specs and pics in the for sale section

Cheers Karl

Luck favours the well prepared

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